San Francisco de Macoris, Dominican Republic

[Lemba]

Protest videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yeSVlfssJlc

http://www.youtube.com/user/ServiciosDePrensa#p/a/u/0/8Eon6Rzq__0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W4aPaFPyA8

[Macorisano]

Since Lemba posted some childhood photos, I tought why not?

This is in SFM. I was tagged and I literally dont know anyone there besides the people around me, who are my family. But I see rubios there, and I see native ancestry.


BTW I found out the people in the photo are family.

[Macorisano]

Ok lets try this again...I was probably trying to white-wash my city with the photos earlier, but I figured out how to open tabs on facebook which has opened a new world for me. So what I did was search friends of mines from SFM, and then search all friends of that person from SFM. I tried choosing photos with 2+ people, but if not I just went with solo pics. I simply went down the list of people I saw and tried choosing one from each. Seeing Bohecoa and Bonao do it has inspired me, so here goes, trying to be as fair as possible. I'll probably do it for Pimentel too, if I have any friends from there.

Note: SOme people like the white guy in one of the photos DOES NOT look Dominican.

[Lemba]

Nice pics, all those phenotypes are within the range of francomacorisanos. It varies so much that in any given pic the people if you notice dont really form any patterns. Its like there is a person my color for every person who is a light tri-racial in s.f.m, LOL. I think s.f.m is the most unpredictable city as far as phenotype. This is the same case with the videos i posted, it has to be the least homogenous city in D.R. Which is why macorisano can post pics where in one group there is 80% light skin tri-racials and in the other only 20%. Genetically this is the case as well, we have one francomacorisana on 23andme who must be a light skin tri-racial is and is 78% Euro , 18% Afro, 6% Asian on 23andme V3. My Grandmother is the most African Francomacorisana, at 38% African in 23andme 44.5% African on Mcdonald. Yet my Grandmother is nowhere as dark and has much straighter hair then her mother. So in her own family her mother wuold've been around 70% Afro, and her Father around 20%. Both Francomacorisanos.

[Macorisano]

Nice pics, all those phenotypes are within the range of francomacorisanos. It varies so much that in any given pic the people if you notice dont really form any patterns. Its like there is a person my color for every person who is a light tri-racial in s.f.m, LOL. I think s.f.m is the most unpredictable city as far as phenotype. This is the same case with the videos i posted, it has to be the least homogenous city in D.R. Which is why macorisano can post pics where in one group there is 80% light skin tri-racials and in the other only 20%. Genetically this is the case as well, we have one francomacorisana on 23andme who must be a light skin tri-racial is and is 78% Euro , 18% Afro, 6% Asian on 23andme V3. My Grandmother is the most African Francomacorisana, at 38% African in 23andme 44.5% African on Mcdonald. Yet my Grandmother is nowhere as dark and has much straighter hair then her mother. So in her own family her mother wuold've been around 70% Afro, and her Father around 20%. Both Francomacorisanos.

Yup, exactly what I notice. Going through people's photos, there would be one group of light-triracials and the next group resemble San Pedro. It really is a crapshoot and this is how it was when I was there. I would be in areas where a dark person would not be found, and be in another where all you would see is brown and dark people. I still say that brown skin is the most prevalent, then after that the really dark and really light people may cancel each other out. Like you said, it's basically Central Cibao/Arab Migration meets Zambo/SSA pred Eastern Cibao. I still say it is the most diverse city in the country.

I am thinking about doing an Eastern Cibao thread, I would include Salcedo, Duarte, Sanchez Ramirez, Maria Trinidad, and Samana. Already in photos, I notice a more zambo predominance in areas like Pimentel, Villa Rivas, and Castillo...much less light skin people so far than SFM. What do you think about the thread idea?

[Bonaoense]

I think Bonao the city may be similar (based on the photos I've seen)

[Macorisano]

I think Bonao the city may be similar (based on the photos I've seen)

I think that La Vega city, Bonao city, and SFM city are all very similar, enough so that if you put photos from each city, people would have a hard time identifying one from the other. The only thing is that since La Vega and Bonao campos are more Euro, on any given day those cities would appear more white if the campesinos decide to head into the city.

[Bohecoa]

The city of La Vega is similar to urban San Francisco de Macoris but it has more light skinned triracials while SFM have more dark zambos and griffes which exist in La Vega in smaller number.

[Macorisano]

I'm bored, so here are some more photos.

[Lemba]

Random Campos pics in s.f.m

[Maroon King]

Random Campos pics in s.f.m

yooo the campo and mad Indigenous influenced phenotypes ....thought I was in Colombia for a minute!

[Macorisano]

In honor of Audobon and his "diversity" pics, here are some "diverse" Francomacorisano's, since you were so kind to show me La Romana and San Cristobal. Alot of them look like stereotypical central Cibaenos, with good reason it being part of the central Cibao from it's origins to about 1900 (130 years), wouldn't be surprised if alot of these people are descendent from them. I see alot of Arab and Native features.

Note: This represents the lighter end of San Francisco, different from what you encounter in the barrios.

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-ash2/368943_1370206243_323913541_n.jpg
http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/369781_598547000_390593423_n.jpg
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[EiCibaeño]

Wow!:lol: My perception of SFM's demographics is changed, I'm used to seeing pictures of quite darker people.

[El Andullero]

Wow!:lol: My perception of SFM's demographics is changed, I'm used to seeing pictures of quite darker people.

In the Duarte province (of which SFM is part), the dynamics are contrary to what happens in Santiago, La Vega and Moca, that is, the campos on Duarte are darker than the provincial capital, specially the more eastern you go (towards Samana).

[Macorisano]

Wow!:lol: My perception of SFM's demographics is changed, I'm used to seeing pictures of quite darker people.

It definitely has alot of light skin tri-racial people (I'd say above the national average) but there are a lot of dark skin people as well. There is a little bit of everything. When I was there, I saw more of the lighter side but there are times when you only see a brown or dark face. Like Andullero has also said, the city of SFM is where the vast majority of those phenotypes are found. The rest of the province is pretty homogeneous. SFM or western Duarte was the only part of the province that was part of the central Cibao (La Vega, Santiago, and finally Moca at one point) and was also where most central cibaenos settled. SFM also had a heavy arab migration.

Id say the city is a mix of say Santiago and the rest of the Duarte Province.

We are in the cibao after all. ;)

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 18:40 ----------

You see alot of morenitos in SFM like these, especially in the barrios.

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/31953_130334313662661_100000582781726_237490_99956 8_n.jpg

But I think that is true for most of the country.

[El Andullero]

It definitely has alot of light skin tri-racial people (I'd say above the national average) but there are a lot of dark skin people as well. There is a little bit of everything. When I was there, I saw more of the lighter side but there are times when you only see a brown or dark face. Like Andullero has also said, the city of SFM is where the vast majority of those phenotypes are found. The rest of the province is pretty homogeneous. SFM or western Duarte was the only part of the province that was part of the central Cibao (La Vega, Santiago, and finally Moca at one point) and was also where most central cibaenos settled. SFM also had a heavy arab migration.

Id say the city is a mix of say Santiago and the rest of the Duarte Province.

We are in the cibao after all. ;)

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 18:40 ----------

You see alot of morenitos in SFM like these, especially in the barrios.

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/31953_130334313662661_100000582781726_237490_99956 8_n.jpg

But I think that is true for most of the country.

I have had the opportunity to see all this by myself, specially since my sister-in-law (older bro's wife) is a member of one of the prominent families of the province (the Javier's), as well as having my two nephews being born in the place.

[Audubon]

the pred. european ones look like stereotypical central cibaenos and middle class dominicans in general, the brown/yellow skinned just like average dominicans...my perception about duarte province changed a little bit when i joined the forum, before i used to think the whole province and its campos were like santiago and espaillat provinces...that's it :)

[EiCibaeño]

In the Duarte province (of which SFM is part), the dynamics are contrary to what happens in Santiago, La Vega and Moca, that is, the campos on Duarte are darker than the provincial capital, specially the more eastern you go (towards Samana).

I thought I remembered Lemba mentioning this but wasn't sure if I remembered correctly. Interesting that it really is the exact opposite of Central Cibao.


We are the beginning of el este after all. ;)

Fixed!:evilgrin:

[Macorisano]

I thought I remembered Lemba mentioning this but wasn't sure if I remembered correctly. Interesting that it really is the exact opposite of Central Cibao.



Fixed!:evilgrin:

:( :'(

[EiCibaeño]

:( :'(

:lol:

I'm just messing around, compai.

Thanks for the photos.

[El Andullero]

This is slightly off-topic, but the earth have been trembling quite a lot today, so much that I fear at a big one is coming. My greatest fear is that in one of these get the dormant volcanoes lying in our Central mountain range to wake up from their long sleep.

[Macorisano]

I will say that some of the SFM Campos being only Zambo and griffe is overplayed. Here are a few videos of different phenotypes in the campos. My grandmother was from La Joya and she was fully white. When I was in the campo, it was very similar to the city, just slightly less euro. However, the other municipalites in the province where very homogenous, but still saw people from both extremes.

Jaya: (Centro Cibaeno looking )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcth7RFS_QE&feature=g-hist&context=G2dd53abAHTxcIRgAUAA

Jaya: (Central Cibaeno looking)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCsv0gStBGQ&feature=related

La Joya (Native American pheno)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8caQ1ayM4r8&feature=related

Loma de Jaya (Central Cibaeno phenos):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCTGmXoZPXs&feature=related

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 19:18 ----------


This is slightly off-topic, but the earth have been trembling quite a lot today, so much that I fear at a big one is coming. My greatest fear is that in one of these get the dormant volcanoes lying in our Central mountain range to wake up from their long sleep.

It's crazy. Every week is a 5.0 magnitude earthquake. How are the people feeling about all the tremors?

[Audubon]

In honor of Audobon and his "diversity" pics, here are some "diverse" Francomacorisano's, since you were so kind to show me La Romana and San Cristobal. Alot of them look like stereotypical central Cibaenos, with good reason it being part of the central Cibao from it's origins to about 1900 (130 years), wouldn't be surprised if alot of these people are descendent from them. I see alot of Arab and Native features.

Note: This represents the lighter end of San Francisco, different from what you encounter in the barrios.

http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-ash2/368943_1370206243_323913541_n.jpg
http://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/hprofile-ak-snc4/369781_598547000_390593423_n.jpg
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most macorisanos i know look like that...i've seen more full white types though

[Lemba]

I will say that some of the SFM Campos being only Zambo and griffe is overplayed. Here are a few videos of different phenotypes in the campos. My grandmother was from La Joya and she was fully white. When I was in the campo, it was very similar to the city, just slightly less euro. However, the other municipalites in the province where very homogenous, but still saw people from both extremes.

Jaya: (Centro Cibaeno looking )

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcth7RFS_QE&feature=g-hist&context=G2dd53abAHTxcIRgAUAA

Jaya: (Central Cibaeno looking)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lCsv0gStBGQ&feature=related

La Joya (Native American pheno)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8caQ1ayM4r8&feature=related

Loma de Jaya (Central Cibaeno phenos):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCTGmXoZPXs&feature=related

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 19:18 ----------



It's crazy. Every week is a 5.0 magnitude earthquake. How are the people feeling about all the tremors?

Nice vids, but it varies alot in a campo, if you show a pic of one or two families it does not encompas a campo. Not long ago i was in "La Guazuma" and my grandmother's family is mostly Zamboid, Mualttoid and Even Mestizoid in phenotype, in descending order. But i saw one Nordic family! So depending on which family in the campos these vids are taken you will have varying phentoypes.

The rest of the duarte province is darker then SFM and most of the campos aroudn it,m but this is not to say that there isnt some Campos or some families in some campos that are just as light as central cibaenyos. For example in La Bajada, some of my Maternal grandmother's father's family lives there, and they are highly nordic mixed with Zamboid/East Indian looking types, but its a highly Euro Campo. Yet Naranjo dulce is a highly Afro campo which is where my maternal grandfathers family is from. I will be posting pics of La Guazuma.

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 20:35 ----------


most macorisanos i know look like that...i've seen more full white types though

Having lived in Macoris, and goign there all the time ive encountered all the types both the lighter and darker ones. I can say the lighter francomacorisanos exist in more abudance in the UPPER middle class, or the high class, people who live in the urbanizaciones. There are plenty of light tri-racial tyueps in the barrios, because ive seen them in teh worst of barrios, the barrios arent all dark, and there are dark francomacorisanos in the upper middle class as well. But generally the rule is like that, the lighter types are in the upper class. The best balanced of class and phenotypical variation is found in pictures taken in "El Parque Duarte" in SFM, since EVERYONE has to pass by there, people going to court, people going shopping for expensive clothes, or a poorer francomacorisano shopping for lettuce in the market. Audubon in what city have you met these macorisanos? I sepnt a large part of my life and still go to wash heights al lthe time and therse alot of diversity in francomacorisanos there, i know plenty of dark ones in addition to the lgiht ones you have probably met.

---------- Post added 2012-01-24 at 20:39 ----------

http://kalle56.com/Gallery/pleytocenso/P/Portada.jpg

[Macorisano]

Lemba I noticed that in La Sirena there were a lot of predominately Euro people, more than the average I would say. Did you/do you notice the same thing?

Nice photo, I'd say that photo does our diversity justice.

[El Andullero]

It's crazy. Every week is a 5.0 magnitude earthquake. How are the people feeling about all the tremors?

Some are taking it in stride, others are reacting very badly, specially since this city isn't as used to these tremors as the provinces in the Cibao are. It's almost a new thing for many people here.

[Lemba]

Lemba I noticed that in La Sirena there were a lot of predominately Euro people, more than the average I would say. Did you/do you notice the same thing?

Hmmm yes, it varies in La Sirena, due to its location there are also people frmo all over the duarte province going there, but its usually very sporadic for lower class people. Most people in la sirena are upper middle class, or middle class. This is because products in La Sirena are generally more expensive then your regular small clothing store, or the neighbor lady who has a husband that sends her clothing barrils frmo NYC = ) I think thats why therse a lighter population in La Sirena vs Mainstream SFM , same case if u go to Ikea in the Capital, you will find much lighter Capitalenyos there, actually VERY comparable to La Sirena.

[Audubon]

the macorisanos i know (about 6-7) look more or less like these and at least two of them look fully white to me (mediterranean)... they're just regular macorisanos from the tristate area.

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/384078_2711242215246_1082595387_33033492_709179216 _n.jpg
http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/261939_10150243103577685_549207684_7734916_6761333 _n.jpg
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/296063_156596014428250_100002335573668_315683_1667 765712_n.jpg
http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/394858_2903386071266_1458901426_32922355_990176046 _n.jpg
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/216390_212644432088083_100000275834902_827697_3554 686_n.jpg
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/306470_195689280501102_100001800931526_411606_5299 76812_n.jpg
http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/24705_368097206946_505421946_3865648_476716_n.jpg
http://a7.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc1/9928_162134930854_627765854_3328561_5144527_n.jpg

i've never met a macorisano darker than that really (or at least i don't remember right now)..they're probably around me all the time and i'm not aware lol.

edit: the other day I met a girl from the capital whose family was from sfm...she looked similar to this girl (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IAT3_XAp1ZU/TaMGZa_XEiI/AAAAAAAABJ0/Ea5ReDQHa9U/s1600/iamdra.jpg), more fina though (i couldn't find a better example)

[Macorisano]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22i6G7hTvsA

Phenotypes in SFM

[Maroon King]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=22i6G7hTvsA

Phenotypes in SFM

I think that lady at 1:09 is a cholita yo :D

[Macorisano]

I think that lady at 1:09 is a cholita yo :D

lol I see what you mean.

What do you think of my city? Phenotype wise.

[Maroon King]

lol I see what you mean.

What do you think of my city? Phenotype wise.

I haven't seen any SSA ppl yet but that Haitian he interviewed by mistake at 4:33. I see ppl who look 'triracial, zambo, mulato, quadroon'.

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 23:07 ----------

Also some pred Euro ppl.

[Macorisano]

I haven't seen any SSA ppl yet but that Haitian he interviewed by mistake at 4:33. I see ppl who look 'triracial, zambo, mulato, quadroon'.

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 23:07 ----------

Also some pred Euro ppl.

Yeah , city definitely looks pred- euro especially when you compare it to other videos like Samana, Capital etc...

nearby Salcedo looks like Cuba, bunch of whites and blacks:lol:

[Maroon King]

Yeah , city definitely looks pred- euro especially when you compare it to other videos like Samana, Capital etc...

nearby Salcedo looks like Cuba, bunch of whites and blacks:lol:

Yo I felt like I just walked through Macoris the way he walked through all those streets and shops :lol: Thanks for the visual tour! You got a video of Salcedo. BTW I can see you and Lemba being from there. :)

[Lemba]

Yeah , city definitely looks pred- euro especially when you compare it to other videos like Samana, Capital etc...

nearby Salcedo looks like Cuba, bunch of whites and blacks:lol:

I wouldn't say SFM looks pred euro, but that there are Some pred. euro phenotypes for sure, for every pred. euro theres a pred. afro

[Macorisano]

I wouldn't say SFM looks pred euro, but that there are Some pred. euro phenotypes for sure, for every pred. euro theres a pred. afro

I see it as two extremes.

You have San Cristobal, La Romana, Capital, Samana, where you see many griffes in the videos. Im talking about mayority. There is a very stark difference in the cities to the north, where mayority are more mullatoid - quadroon.

Then you have northern cities, where you see much less griffes. In the SFM video, I did not see one real dark macorisano. Of course places like La Vega have the more off white lookin people, but if you take the videos as examples, SFM definitely comes out pred euro. Ive seen all the videos. SFM ends up looking like Mao /Salcedo.

Bohecoa put it best when he said, San Pedro and San Francisco could both be mulatto. The difference being that SFM is a 50 euro - 40 afro, while San Pedro is a 50 afro - 40 euro variety. The general area follows suit.



Basically, show me SFM and I would place it somewhere in the north.

Salcedo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-sJgQ1OeMM

[kilometro7]

This tehe Calle del Santiago, note this is the street were most Barrio people go to shop, and people from all over the Cibao if not from all over the country gather, so it probably looks darker than the rest of the city.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=609nCdS7k9Y&list=UU9TcpOnceSTzkyl9UdAGJlg&index=25&feature=plcp

[El Andullero]

This tehe Calle del Santiago, note this is the street were most Barrio people go to shop, and people from all over the Cibao if not from all over the country gather, so it probably looks darker than the rest of the city.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=609nCdS7k9Y&list=UU9TcpOnceSTzkyl9UdAGJlg&index=25&feature=plcp

Yeah, it can be quite the contrast when you get outside of that area and get to visit Baitoa, Jacagua, Gurabo and the like.

[Macorisano]

This tehe Calle del Santiago, note this is the street were most Barrio people go to shop, and people from all over the Cibao if not from all over the country gather, so it probably looks darker than the rest of the city.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=609nCdS7k9Y&list=UU9TcpOnceSTzkyl9UdAGJlg&index=25&feature=plcp

It definitely looks like Urban Santiago. That's probably the part of Santiago where you can find most pred-Afro people?

BTW there is also one of San Jose de Las Matas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgOAtJs2y9w

I think La Vega had the most "white phenotypes", then Salcedo and Sajoma follow, with Sajoma having much less griffes than Salcedo.

Darkest was Samana, and one of the capital I saw.

[Maroon King]

Macorisano, Salcedo is looking like SFM not Cuba :whoco:

[Macorisano]

Macorisano, Salcedo is looking like SFM not Cuba :whoco:

No, Salcedo had more people who can pass as whites. You didn't see them?

[kilometro7]

Yeah, it can be quite the contrast when you get outside of that area and get to visit Baitoa, Jacagua, Gurabo and the like.

Yeah, although even there in the most urban part you can still see more whites, and light skin people than most other cities. You can also see a big contrast if you go from la calla del sol to the traditional barrios like Los pepines, La joya, Villa olympica etc.. who still hold populations of true native Santiagueros.

[Lemba]

I see it as two extremes.

You have San Cristobal, La Romana, Capital, Samana, where you see many griffes in the videos. Im talking about mayority. There is a very stark difference in the cities to the north, where mayority are more mullatoid - quadroon.

Then you have northern cities, where you see much less griffes. In the SFM video, I did not see one real dark macorisano. Of course places like La Vega have the more off white lookin people, but if you take the videos as examples, SFM definitely comes out pred euro. Ive seen all the videos. SFM ends up looking like Mao /Salcedo.

Bohecoa put it best when he said, San Pedro and San Francisco could both be mulatto. The difference being that SFM is a 50 euro - 40 afro, while San Pedro is a 50 afro - 40 euro variety. The general area follows suit.



Basically, show me SFM and I would place it somewhere in the north.

Salcedo:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-sJgQ1OeMM

50/40 doesn't make SFM look pred. Euro, i agree in parts of the east, and parts of the cibao like Samana or Dajabon/Jimani you see constant griffes, while in SFM thats not the case, but you also don't see constant pred. euros. Its very much balanced. The only place that i seen in D.R that was pred. Euro was Santiago and Moca, and Moca is more pred euro on the Santiago side then on the Salcedo side. When i mean pred euruo, 6 out of 10 people you see are very light, and pred. euro, not necesarily as euro as kilo but close.

In SFM you will never see that, that constantly unless you are in the suburbs. It would be like 3 pred euro ppl, 3 Zamboid/griffes, and 4 Mid-tone ppl.

I also don't think theres many quadroons in SFM, most people look pretty evenly mixed, Quadroonish would be someone like Trujillo or his brother,
http://www.pasoapaso.com.do/public_files/imagenes/negro-trujillo_Ojo_jpg_480x290_crop-,0_upscale_q95.jpg

Remember its very hard to end up at 50/50 mulatto, or even 40/40, 35-65% afro can be in the mulattoid range, although i'd say most mulattoids are in the 40 to 60% afro or 40/60% euro range.

[Maroon King]

No, Salcedo had more people who can pass as whites. You didn't see them?

I didn't see 'real' whites but pred Euro ppl

[kilometro7]

The only place that i seen in D.R that was pred. Euro was Santiago and Moca, and Moca is more pred euro on the Santiago side then on the Salcedo side. When i mean pred euruo, 6 out of 10 people you see are very light, and pred. euro, not necesarily as euro as kilo but close.
e.

6 out of 10 people pred euro would be in the urban parts, rural parts can be up to 8 out of 10 people. I also think many places in La Vega, Valverde, and Santiago Rodriguez are pred European, in short pretty much the Cibao Central.

BTW have you guys seen the Bani video, there's more pred SSA people than most all Cibaeno cities, expect for samana, for those who consider Samana to be part of the Cibao.

[Maroon King]

Ok I finally saw a white girl at 8:07 !

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 23:48 ----------

and at 9:34 another white woman

[El Andullero]

6 out of 10 people pred euro would be in the urban parts, rural parts can be up to 8 out of 10 people. I also think many places in La Vega, Valverde, and Santiago Rodriguez are pred European, in short pretty much the Cibao Central.

BTW have you guys seen the Bani video, there's more pred SSA people than most all Cibaeno cities, expect for samana, for those who consider Samana to be part of the Cibao.

One could say that most of the mixing there have been more recent than elsewhere. My grandma always tells me that both Lilis and Trujillo had the practice of putting black governors on the place in order to curb their racist tendencies.

[Maroon King]

those are the only white ppl I saw, everyone else would be called a mestizo or mulato in Colombia. The few pred SSA ones afro.

(SALCEDO video)

[Macorisano]

50/40 doesn't make SFM look pred. Euro, i agree in parts of the east, and parts of the cibao like Samana or Dajabon/Jimani you see constant griffes, while in SFM thats not the case, but you also don't see constant pred. euros. Its very much balanced. The only place that i seen in D.R that was pred. Euro was Santiago and Moca, and Moca is more pred euro on the Santiago side then on the Salcedo side. When i mean pred euruo, 6 out of 10 people you see are very light, and pred. euro, not necesarily as euro as kilo but close.

In SFM you will never see that, that constantly unless you are in the suburbs. It would be like 3 pred euro ppl, 3 Zamboid/griffes, and 4 Mid-tone ppl.



I agree that Moca and Santiago are the whitest areas of the DR. But if you look at the Moca video, you see mostly mulattos as well. Compare SFM and Moca videos, and you would see that they are MORE similar, than SFM and Samana. Of course, this is one video, but if you look at the older Sondeo video, you would see more of the same. I like the location it was recorded in, an urban marketplace, because it covers the mayority of the financial spectrum. However it leans more to the poor barrio people, than the upper class people.

Also, those 3 pred euro, 3 zamboid griffes, 4 mid tones, are still going to be one of the lighter cities when you take into account, that there are a plethora of cities in the DR in which you see 6 griffes/ 3 mulattos / 1 pred euro. The balanced showing of people are found mostly in the northern interior. You could say the same 3 pred euro, 3 zamboid griffes, 4 midtones would be seen in Bonao, or Salcedo, and I would believe it.

I just dont see most DR cities on that level. Santiago, Moca, Bani, and Santiago Rodriguez, would stand out in pred euro. Urban La Vega is not quite there, but its campos sure would. Other than those cities, SFM could stand on it's own with its diversity. It's in the same range as most northern cities.

Quadroons, Octoroons, or off whites, when I say that I just mean pred euro. I can't really differentiate between them.

---------- Post added 2012-04-03 at 23:54 ----------


6 out of 10 people pred euro would be in the urban parts, rural parts can be up to 8 out of 10 people. I also think many places in La Vega, Valverde, and Santiago Rodriguez are pred European, in short pretty much the Cibao Central.

BTW have you guys seen the Bani video, there's more pred SSA people than most all Cibaeno cities, expect for samana, for those who consider Samana to be part of the Cibao.

Interesting. I thought Bani was on Central Cibao level.

To me Esperanza is similar to Salcedo, while SFM is similar to Mao. If you want to compare north eastern and north western. It goes back to the gradient Lemba spoke about. I am very much in agreement with it.

[kilometro7]

Btw I would advise not to take these videos to heart as a perfect representation of these cities. In all the videos, the guy usually goes to the most urban, and poorest parts of the cities.

[Maroon King]

Btw I would advise not to take these videos to heart as a perfect representation of these cities. In all the videos, the guy usually goes to the most urban, and poorest parts of the cities.

It's the closest I've gotten to DR though :p

[Lemba]

I think Macoris overlpas with Salceod, and some parts of Moca, although mostly with the eastern side of Moca, it also overlaps with Cotui and Nagua, Althouh the latter two are slightly more afro on average. Just like Moca is slightly mor euro and salcedo. I know that SFM doesn't overlap with Samana, but its not that far from Samana's smaller towns, like Sanchez which borders Nagua.

I went to San Pedro de Macoris last year and it looked pred. Afro with a sizeable amount of Zamboids and griffes, there was a good amount of whitse there too but they looked unmixed, they did nto look ambigous/off-white like the ones im used to seeing in SFM, they looked straight out of Spain/France/Italy. BUT SPM seemed alot more afro then SFM.

I think the bigger cities will have the most phenotypical variatin because we have alot of people move in from differnet parts, our population is not very homogenous, small towns are very homogenous, take for example Gurabo or Pimentel, will be homogenous.

---------- Post added 2012-04-04 at 00:05 ----------

As far as the social classes, i htink the video was great in SFM, as most people in the vid where passing by, eveyroen of all social classes in SFM passes through th mercado in cars, and the park in cars, as alot of the jobs are in that area. Its kinda like the downtown manhattan of SFM.

[Macorisano]

edit

[Cumayasa]

I agree with Kilometro. In the video of La Romana, for example, he made the interview around the parque central which is full of people from nearby sugarcane towns (like Guaymate and Lechuga) because the bus usually stops there. You see more diversity in the neighborhoods, and I mean middle lower class neigborhoods.

Some cities in the DR seems pretty black when you're just driving through, but visiting the actual barrios/neighborhoods is pretty different, not sure why. Somehow, the phenotype of the people using private cars is usually different than the one of the citizen on foot.

---------- Post added 2012-04-04 at 18:17 ----------



I went to San Pedro de Macoris last year and it looked pred. Afro with a sizeable amount of Zamboids and griffes, there was a good amount of whitse there too but they looked unmixed, they did nto look ambigous/off-white like the ones im used to seeing in SFM, they looked straight out of Spain/France/Italy. BUT SPM seemed alot more afro then SFM.


How would you breakdown the demographics in San Pedro?

[Lemba]

This are some good videos showing phenotypical diversity in SFM, they are in HD, the first one is a picture video mainly, so clear to see, the second a protest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTG8bF5qU14&hd=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZN2mUjP6Rc&hd=1

This one is very clear too! and the teacher i know in person.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gV6TcEiqm4&hd=1

[Macorisano]

Great videos Lemba, it does show the range of phenotypes well. Are all the social classes represented in the 2nd video? Also the lady in the last video sounds and looks Puerto Rican.