New branches of R1a1a1 - post all updates here plz

[EastPole]

A thought came to my mind when I compared R1a1-M458 map:

[IMG]In this hypothesis we get Sloveni-Stavani-Suobeni as one very large group inhabiting the whole temperate zone from of Eastern Europe (from Poland to Wolga - large part of the former Corded Ware territory)

Such theories are being considered by many researches:

But the result can be interpreted also differently—it lends credence to those theories, which suggest that early Common Era Zarubintsy and Chernyakhov cultures, extending from the upper-central basins of Prut to Don, used already Slavonic languages—i.e., Slavic-speaking tribes were present in a considerable part of the later southern-central part of the historic Russia considerably earlier than better-documented Slavic migrations in approximately the 6th–9th centuries. It could then explain why there is a remarkable patrilineal continuity within West and East Slavonic-language speaking populations, although there are still signs of some admixture of the central-southern Russians with Finnic-speaking (or Baltic-speaking) populations, testified by NRY hg N. There is also an alternative explanation: Time depth of R1a (e.g.,4) might well be considerably older than separation of Indo-Iranian and Slavonic languages (and their speakers) from common Indo-European source,38 and the shared Y chromosomal ancestry might therefore antedate their linguistic differentiation.

”Two Sources of the Russian Patrilineal Heritage in Their Eurasian Context” Balanovsky at al. 2008.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2253976/

There are many reasons to believe that Slavic types of R1a1 expanded much earlier than 6th–9th centuries.
Balanovsky thinks that Zarubintsy and Chernyakhov cultures, extending from the upper-central basins of Prut to Don, were already using Slavonic languages.
R1a1 could have expanded even earlier i.e. with IE before separation of Indo-Iranian and Slavonic languages (and their speakers).
But Indo-Iranian R1a1 is different and absent in Europe and their language probably originated in Asia around BMCA.
Therefore the hypothesis that “the whole temperate zone of Eastern Europe (from Poland to Wolga - large part of the former Corded Ware territory)” was populated by Slavic type of R1a1 and various Proto-Slavic speaking groups in the Bronze Age is very likely. We need aDNA to make sure.

[muso]

Quote from Wojewoda: " a tribe called Stavani (Stavanoi) which was said to live in European Sarmatia..."
Good point Wojewoda. I believe that I have read that European Sarmatia extended into the Carpathian plain to include parts of present Hungary.

[Wojewoda]

In this hypothesis we get Sloveni-Stavani-Suobeni as one very large group inhabiting the whole temperate zone from of Eastern Europe (from Poland to Wolga - large part of the former Corded Ware territory) (...)

To be precise the Continental - as opposed to Atlantic - part of the temperate zone:

[Wojewoda]

Global Amphora Culture map:



Similar?

[EastPole]

Global Amphora Culture map:



Similar?

R1a1 distribution corresponds to Globular Amphora and Corded Ware combined.

[muso]

The Global Amphora Culture preceded the Corded ware Culture, correct?

[Wojewoda]

^Yes:

The Globular Amphora Culture (GAC), German Kugelamphoren-Kultur (KAK), ca. 3400-2800 BC, is an archaeological culture preceding the central area occupied by the Corded Ware culture. (...) It occupied much of the same area as the earlier Funnelbeaker culture.

For anyone interested a map of Western GAC sites:



Does it match the Western extent of M458?

[muso]

Does it match the Western extent of M458?

I would say yes. When you remove medieval migration westward by those who were primarily German in name, M458 got about as far as Mecklenburg and Holstein: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obotrites.

[soulblighter]

Looks like L342 may be susceptible to recombination, if I understand things correctly....another SNP limbo for Z93+.
http://eng.molgen.org/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=571

[Polako]

Looks like L342 may be susceptible to recombination, if I understand things correctly....another SNP limbo for Z93+.
http://eng.molgen.org/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=571

Maybe that's why the STR diversity of R1a is so high in India?