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Thread: Gracilization in North East Asians1520 days old

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    Default Gracilization in North East Asians

    How would South Korean soccer star Ahn Jung Hwan be classified? He is a archetypal gracilized NE Asian with natural wavy hair. This can be found in moderate numbers North of the Yellow River in China and in the Korean Peninsula but rarely in Mongols or Manchu. Is this trait local variability or from admixture of nomadic groups from the North and West? Couple examples:

    Ahn Jung Hwan and Li Weifeng
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    Last edited by dsong2006; 2010-09-02 at 19:55.

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    your question is two-fold:
    - wavy hair natural among north-east asians but not mongol/nomad groups
    - gracilization

    I think in general the north-sinid racial type is gracile by definition, The mongol etnicities have a much stronger tungid element in them which lacks this inherent gracileness.

    Regarding the wavy hair: not sure, i think its more of a random admixture than something of a local population thing. Japanese, chinese and korean all dont seem to have large frequencies of wavy haired people

    the korean guy seems north-sinid + a bit of yakonid. he looks japanese.

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    Quote Originally Posted by solkiM View Post
    your question is two-fold:
    - wavy hair natural among north-east asians but not mongol/nomad groups
    - gracilization

    I think in general the north-sinid racial type is gracile by definition, The mongol etnicities have a much stronger tungid element in them which lacks this inherent gracileness.

    Regarding the wavy hair: not sure, i think its more of a random admixture than something of a local population thing. Japanese, chinese and korean all dont seem to have large frequencies of wavy haired people

    the korean guy seems north-sinid + a bit of yakonid. he looks japanese.
    Thanks for refining my question! But here is the confusing thing about gracilization, how much of it is due to admixture from old Turkic/Indo-Europeans aka Xiongu, Xianbei, Touba Turks Yuezhi and Tocharians. Many of these nomadics peoples build dynasties, changed their names to Chinese and were completely incorporated into what is a relative recent concept which is Han Chinese. How much of the gracilization is purely due to variation variation and localization of existing Sinid types. Also Koreans have a fairly large frequency of people ranging from fully wavy to slightly wave haired people. Much higher than Japanese and Chinese from what I've observed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dsong2006 View Post
    Thanks for refining my question! But here is the confusing thing about gracilization, how much of it is due to admixture from old Turkic/Indo-Europeans aka Xiongu, Xianbei, Touba Turks Yuezhi and Tocharians. Many of these nomadics peoples build dynasties, changed their names to Chinese and were completely incorporated into what is a relative recent concept which is Han Chinese. How much of the gracilization is purely due to variation variation and localization of existing Sinid types. Also Koreans have a fairly large frequency of people ranging from fully wavy to slightly wave haired people. Much higher than Japanese and Chinese from what I've observed.
    Sorry for the late response! lol

    You have to keep in mind that gracilization is not a phenomenon that is parallel with europids. Rather its sexual selection along with the necessary environment and population characteristics and this can happen in theory eventually with every population.

    Moreover, i dont believe that such slight population element of only partly gracile europids (assuming that they were only gracile europid-mongolid hybrids) can have such a substantial impact on the whole Chinese population in such a short time.

    What is much more likely is that higher quality environments were the perfect cradle for gracilization of the sinid population; a process which occured many years before Turkic impact, just as it has naturally occured with europids (and some negrids).

    Regarding wavy haired Koreans. So far i have never seen a wavy haired korean...im not sure if there really is a trend among the Koreans. It could be that there is still a australoid admixture present among the population? But this is only mere speculation. Moreover i dont see why Korea would be a a better environment for facilitating wavy hair than Japan, considering there close vicinity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dsong2006 View Post
    Thanks for refining my question! But here is the confusing thing about gracilization, how much of it is due to admixture from old Turkic/Indo-Europeans aka Xiongu, Xianbei, Touba Turks Yuezhi and Tocharians. Many of these nomadics peoples build dynasties, changed their names to Chinese and were completely incorporated into what is a relative recent concept which is Han Chinese. How much of the gracilization is purely due to variation variation and localization of existing Sinid types. Also Koreans have a fairly large frequency of people ranging from fully wavy to slightly wave haired people. Much higher than Japanese and Chinese from what I've observed.
    I don't see wat you're trying to prove bu the amount of wavy hair is far more observable among japanese than koreans

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    Quote Originally Posted by solkiM View Post
    Sorry for the late response! lol

    You have to keep in mind that gracilization is not a phenomenon that is parallel with europids. Rather its sexual selection along with the necessary environment and population characteristics and this can happen in theory eventually with every population.
    So this supposed "gracilization" process is the result of both sexual selection and environment? Can you explain further? What is the purpose/significance of gracilization?

    What comes to mind is slenderness and angularity, reminiscent of what is considered attractive in some Western cultures.

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