User Tag List

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2
Results 11 to 19 of 19

Thread: Native American descendants in Europe2695 days old

  1. #11
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Caipira's Avatar
    Last Online
    2014-12-05 @ 00:53
    Join Date
    2014-01-13
    Posts
    577
    Gender
    Race
    Caucasoid
    Phenotype
    Mediterranid
    Politics
    Liberal conservative
    Religion
    Roman Catholicism
    Brazil Portugal 1485 Portugal Spain Castile Spain traditional Spain

    Default

    The French took many Tupinambás back to France in the early 16th century. In 1550, during the entry of king Henry II of France at Rouen, about 50 indians staged a fight as a show to the monarch. After the destruction of France Antarctique, I don't doubt that some indians converted to Protestantism were brought back to France or resettled elsewhere, as they would probably face death if they remained there.

    Many African slaves were brought to Portugal in the 15/16th centuries, as some travelers that were in the country wrote about it (Jerônimo Münzer, a german doctor visiting the country in 1494, said about the subject). Based on this, I don't doubt that, when the Dutch took the Portuguese sources for African slaves, they did had to rely on Amerindians (and Asians) instead, as happened in Brazil. Many rich settlers from the richest regions at that time (like Pernambuco and Bahia) bought amerindian slaves from paulistas to compensate the absence of African slaves in that period when the Dutch had control of Angola, for example, so I don't doubt that the same trade happened with mainland Portugal.

  2. # ADS
    Advertisement bot
    Join Date
    2013-03-24
    Posts
    All threads
       
     

  3. #12
    Established Member
    Viceroyalty of New Spain Celph Titled's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2013-12-07
    Posts
    6,687
    Gender
    Phenotype
    Mediterranid
    Ethnicity
    Mexican-American
    Phenotype
    Atlanto-Med + CM
    United States Mexico Guam Philippines Palau

    Default

    this lady is descendent of the Aztec king Monteczuma



    these can also trace their linage to the Aztec king





    Aztec princess Xipaguazin Moctezuma also lived in Spain, she had 1 child with her Spanish conquistador husband, anyways she lived in Cataluña, you can read more about it here

    http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolor%C3%ADu


    anyways most people with Aztec royalty linage live in Spain funny how they are more Aztec than the Aztec wannabe Chicanos from the Mexica Movement

  4. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Celph Titled For This Useful Post:

    Litvin (2018-03-12), searching (2014-09-26), Semitic Duwa (2014-09-27)

  5. #13
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Ebersdorf's Avatar
    Last Online
    Yesterday @ 14:15
    Join Date
    2012-03-06
    Posts
    478
    Gender
    Age
    57

    Default

    My wife descends from Moctezuma through his daughter Mariana Leonor de Moctezuma who married the conquistador Cristobal de Valderrama. This branch of his descendants is known as the Aguascalientes branch. Here is an interesting article (to me) detailing the descent of my wife's ancestors, the Ruiz de Esparzas/Tiscareno de Molinas from Moctezuma:

    http://latinola.com/story.php?story=12449
    Last edited by Ebersdorf; 2014-09-27 at 15:45.

  6. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Ebersdorf For This Useful Post:

    searching (2014-09-27), Semitic Duwa (2014-09-27), Ubirajara (2014-09-28)

  7. #14
    Wiki Editor
    Moderator
    Your favourite (((Skype))) Semitic Duwa's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2010-02-26
    Posts
    3,372
    Location
    In your closet
    Gender
    Y-DNA
    J1-Z18271 (YSC234+)
    mtDNA
    J1c5
    Race
    Caucasoid
    Metaethnos
    (((Skype))) + British
    Ethnicity
    (((Shasu of Yhw)))
    Politics
    Pump & Trump
    Religion
    Jehovah's Fitness
    Israel Israel Star of David Israel Israel

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Celph Titled View Post
    this lady is descendent of the Aztec king Monteczuma



    these can also trace their linage to the Aztec king





    Aztec princess Xipaguazin Moctezuma also lived in Spain, she had 1 child with her Spanish conquistador husband, anyways she lived in Cataluña, you can read more about it here

    http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tolor%C3%ADu


    anyways most people with Aztec royalty linage live in Spain funny how they are more Aztec than the Aztec wannabe Chicanos from the Mexica Movement
    ROFL, reminds me of all the Jewish monarchists out there who claim that Yosef Dayan is a lineal descendant of King David (don't laugh, rabbinical authorities claim that his paper trail is legit) and that he should become king of Israel.
    The crazier the merrier as they say

    Heck, my mother's family claims descent from Ragnar Lodbrok through his son Ivar the Boneless (and, in turn, through his descendant Godred Crovan/King Orry Of The Isle Of Man*).... Never really thought much of it until two Norwegian descendants of Harald Fairhair (with the paper trail to prove it) showed up in my relative finder!
    Serves me right, lol.

    *Here's his family tree, you might wanna take a look: http://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Haraldsson-4
    Last edited by Semitic Duwa; 2014-09-27 at 21:17.


    Quote Originally Posted by MnM View Post
    Morocco is a western lapdog.
    Quote Originally Posted by NonFingo View Post
    Those Bronze Age samples are just red herrings to distract you from the actual arrivals of populations with Semitic ancestry. Don’t take the bait by focusing on the wrong samples, lol. He is passing off Bronze Age Levantines with no evidence of strong predynastic input, as “Semites“. This way, he can flip it around and say Proto-Semitic speakers and predynastics were more or less identical to the Bronze Age Levantines sampled so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by NonFingo View Post
    @Semitic Duwa

    Wonder what the resident Proto-Semite has to say about this. I thought unmixed Egyptians were supposed to be Abusir with less/zero Chl?

    In your view, does this prove you wrong, or is it just a coincidence () that M1 is absent in one of the three subsamples from Abusir, and rare overall?

    And don’t change your signature now, please. I’m looking forward to you looking more and more incompetent as more aDNA is published. Wish there was a way to speed this up. But the extra wait and seeing you with your pants down every day, kinda has its own appeal, too.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Semitic Duwa For This Useful Post:

    Awale (2014-09-27)

  9. #15
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist oditous's Avatar
    Last Online
    2015-07-17 @ 20:36
    Join Date
    2010-01-07
    Posts
    3,889
    Gender

    Default

    From a recent study done by 23andme, in order to check how significant Amerindian admixture among European Americans might be they compared with results for about 15.000 selfidentified (4GP) Europeans among their client database. It seems the Spaniards have the most of it. When excluding Spain and a couple of other countries it's hardly detectable though. They also found 21 Amerindian maternal haplogroups among the samples But again most of them in Spain.

    To this end, we generated a cohort of 15, 289 23andMe customers who reported that all four of their grandparents were born in the same European country. The use of four grandparent birth-country has been utilized as a proxy for assessing ancestry, see for example 78, 79. We then examined ancestry composition results for these individuals, and calculated how at what rate we detected at least 1% African and at least 1% Native American ancestry. Overall, we find very low levels of African and Native ancestry, with 0.98% of Europeans showing African ancestry, and 0.26% of Europeans carry Native American ancestry. These levels are substantially lower than the 3.5% and 2.7% of European Americans that carry African and Native American ancestry, respectively.
    Excluding countries that had major and minor ports in the Atlantic with strong connections to the slave trade (namely, Portugal, Spain, France, United Kingdom) and Malta, which has been the site of migrations from Africa and the Middle East (from Phoenicia and Carthage) and served as a major port since the completion of the Suez Canal. Excluding these countries, we obtain a dataset of 9, 701 Europeans, where we find African and Native American ancestry is virtually absent, with only 0.04% of individuals carrying 1% or more African ancestry, and 0.01% carrying 1% or more Native American ancestry, within the margins of survey error estimates
    We find that the frequency of Native American haplogroups correlates with our estimates of genome-wide ancestry in European Americans and African Americans, and are found at appreciable fractions of individuals who are estimated to carry Native American ancestry. The frequencies of aplogroups are shown in Table S7. Furthermore, these haplogroups are virtually absent in individuals with four grandparents from a European country (21 individuals out of 15,651). Furthermore, the majority of these haplogroups are found in individuals from Spain, suggesting the possibility of geneflow returning from the Americas into Spain, which may also be reponsible for driving higher levels of genetic diversity in Europeans from the Iberian peninsula. Excluding Spain, overall Native American specific haplogroups are detected in less than 0.05% of individuals with four grandparents from Europe



    Quote Originally Posted by Discoblastula View Post
    Public self-congratulation (racism, social Darwinism, elitism in general) is something I avoid looking at, like being on the same subway car with a masturbating homeless schizophrenic.

    High IQs are overrated. Knowledge, however, isn't.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to oditous For This Useful Post:

    Ubirajara (2014-10-08)

  11. #16
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist inquisitive's Avatar
    Last Online
    2016-03-14 @ 03:11
    Join Date
    2012-02-21
    Posts
    1,452
    Location
    Central Florida
    Gender
    Y-DNA
    R1b1b2a1a1*
    mtDNA
    L2c
    Ethnicity
    AA
    Barbados Jamaica United States Cuba

    Default

    I think Lemba said he shares with someone from Spain who has a Native American Y DNA haplogroup.

  12. #17
    Established Member
    Junior Member
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2009-10-26
    Posts
    6,116
    Gender
    Ethnicity
    Brazilian
    Brazil

    Default

    I share with a Spanish whose score is about ~3,2% native american, it is the highest I have seen among people born in Spain to an overwhelmingly Iberian background. He is 1/8 Chilean, 7/8 Spanish. I've also seen some Canary Islanders, Azoreans and Portuguese to show very minor native american results, like 0,2%, which I am not sure is noise or not.

    This is the result of a Southern Portuguese, f.e (noise or not?):



    Quote Originally Posted by oditous View Post
    From a recent study done by 23andme, in order to check how significant Amerindian admixture among European Americans might be they compared with results for about 15.000 selfidentified (4GP) Europeans among their client database. It seems the Spaniards have the most of it. When excluding Spain and a couple of other countries it's hardly detectable though. They also found 21 Amerindian maternal haplogroups among the samples But again most of them in Spain.










    Sche innam me pepicke keseagu

  13. #18
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist oditous's Avatar
    Last Online
    2015-07-17 @ 20:36
    Join Date
    2010-01-07
    Posts
    3,889
    Gender

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ubirajara View Post
    I've also seen some Canary Islanders, Azoreans and Portuguese to show very minor native american results, like 0,2%, which I am not sure is noise or not.
    I've also seen it on 1Portuguese i'm sharing with, she had 0.2% and even somewhat higher for a few Cape Verdeans

    There's a known noise issue for 100% Africans who almost always score <0,1% Amerindian or SE Asian in speculative. Like this person from Cameroon



    In almost all cases those would definitely be noise, but if it goes above 0,1% i suppose there's a possibility it could also be genuine. I'm sharing with 1 Yoruba from Nigeria who scores 0.3%. Of course this could still also be noise given how there were much higher fake Asian %'s for Africans on the very first Ancestry painting by 23andme. And the current %'s are only as good as the next update will prove them to be But who knows perhaps he does have some returned AfroBrazilian ancestry, many liberated "Nago's" from Bahia migrating to Lagos and Benin in the late 1800's.

    Last edited by oditous; 2014-10-08 at 14:28.
    Quote Originally Posted by Discoblastula View Post
    Public self-congratulation (racism, social Darwinism, elitism in general) is something I avoid looking at, like being on the same subway car with a masturbating homeless schizophrenic.

    High IQs are overrated. Knowledge, however, isn't.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to oditous For This Useful Post:

    Ubirajara (2014-10-08)

  15. #19
    QBS Banned
    Molecular Biologist
    Last Online
    2018-04-13 @ 11:01
    Join Date
    2016-12-19
    Posts
    1,280
    Gender
    European Union

    Default

    I think that in Iceland there is some minor Native American admixture.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 1 2

Similar Threads

  1. Native American of the USA (old pics)
    By Magneto in forum Americas
    Replies: 44
    Last Post: 2014-06-10, 06:18
  2. Native American music
    By Nephilim in forum Arts & Culture
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: 2014-05-06, 16:45
  3. Classify this gay native american boy
    By cut3 in forum Classification Requests
    Replies: 86
    Last Post: 2011-01-30, 07:43
  4. Caucasiod looking Native American
    By SilverI in forum Typology & Classifications
    Replies: 110
    Last Post: 2010-05-23, 14:16
  5. Native American Sterlized by the American government
    By Nephilim in forum Race & Ethnicity in Society
    Replies: 101
    Last Post: 2010-03-26, 20:04

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
<