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View Poll Results: The Trojan War, Fact or Fiction?

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Thread: Did the Trojan War really happen?3544 days old

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    Default Did the Trojan War really happen?

    Of course many here have heard about it where we all know (or those who care anyway) that Heinrich Schliemann discovered a city, that we recognize as the city of Troy, as described by Homer in the Iliad. However, many people debate whatever there was a War at all

    Let's here some opinions on this, and please back it up with facts. I think some archeologists found remains of a city or burial site where the war had allegedly taken play. Although, many people still have doubts on.

    To get a basic understanding visit this, feel free to provide anymore info to support your argument..
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troy

    So, was the Trojan War, a fact or fiction? Do you have doubts about it?

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    I think something happened, but whether it was a single event, or a combination of old legends is difficult to say. The actual persons were probably not real people, but I believe the events are somehow inspired by real events. Of course, the actual events could have been drastically different (hey, a god makes some runner fall so her favourite can win? Doesn't sound like actual history to me!)

    Schliemann seems to have had a personal agenda with this, so I wouldn't trust him on this. Some people say that it's Troy, others disagree. I think it's unproven either way. I don't know?

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    It has certain historical background.

    If we take a sight at a mycennean armor we'll realize that the heels are the only unprotected part of the body (add the greaves to the image), and Achiles had a helmet made of wild boar canine teeth (Homer, Illyad)



    There were belic epysodes there, perhaps realted to the 1200 bC crisis and the sea peoples. Hitite and egyptian texts gives some clues about all those dramatic events.

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    There is a theory that Troy really happened not in the ancient Greece, but it happened in the Nordic World (Gulf of Finland).

    On the other hand, the Danish medieval historian Saxo Grammaticus, in his Gesta Danorum, often mentions a people known as “Hellespontians” and a region called Hellespont, which, strangely enough, seems to be located in the east of the Baltic Sea. Could it be Homer’s Hellespont? We can further identify it with the Gulf of Finland, which is the geographic counterpart of the Dardanelles (as both of them lie northeast of their respective basins). Since Troy, according to the Iliad, lay northeast of the sea (another reason to dispute Schliemann’s location), then it seems reasonable, for the purpose of this research, to look at a region of southern Finland, where the Gulf of Finland joins the Baltic Sea. In this area, west of Helsinki, we find a number of place-names which astonishingly resemble those mentioned in the Iliad and, in particular, the names of the allies of the Trojans: Askainen (Ascanius), Reso (Rhesus), Karjaa (Caria), Nästi (Nastes, the chief of the Carians), Lyökki (Lycia), Tenala (Tenedos), Kiila (Cilla), Kiikoinen (Ciconians), etc. There is also a Padva, which reminds us of Italian Padua, which was founded, according to tradition, by the Trojan Antenor and lies in Veneto. (The “Eneti” or “Veneti” were allies of the Trojans.) What is more, the place-names Tanttala and Sipilä (the mythical King Tantalus, famous for his torment, was buried on Mount Sipylus) indicate that this matter is not only limited to Homeric geography, but seems to extend to the whole world of Greek mythology.
    Una possibile chiave per penetrare finalmente in questa singolare realtà geografica ce la fornisce Plutarco, il quale in una sua opera, il De facie quae in orbe lunae apparet, fa un'affermazione sorprendente: l'isola Ogigia, dove la dea Calipso trattenne a lungo Ulisse prima di consentirgli il ritorno ad Itaca, è situata nell'Atlantico del nord, «a cinque giorni di navigazione dalla Britannia».

    Partendo da tale indicazione e seguendo la rotta verso est, indicata nel V libro dell'Odissea, percorsa da Ulisse dopo la sua partenza dall'isola (identificabile con una delle Färöer, tra le quali si riscontra un nome curiosamente "grecheggiante": Mykines), si riesce subito a localizzare la terra dei Feaci, la Scheria, sulla costa meridionale della Norvegia, in un'area in cui abbondano i reperti dell'età del bronzo. Qui, al momento dell'approdo di Ulisse nella terra dei Feaci, si verifica una sorta di "miracolo": il fiume (dove il giorno successivo il nostro eroe incontrerà Nausicaa) ad un certo punto inverte il senso della corrente ed accoglie il naufrago all'interno della sua foce. Tale fenomeno, incomprensibile nel Mediterraneo, sembra attestare proprio una localizzazione nordatlantica, dove in effetti l'alta marea produce la periodica inversione del flusso negli estuari (nel Tamigi la risalita dell'onda di marea, che favorisce l'ingresso delle navi nel porto, proprio come accade ad Ulisse, è di molti chilometri). Inoltre, nell'antica lingua nordica "skerja" significava "scoglio".

    Sources:
    http://www.centrostudilaruna.it/feli...ionoftroy.html
    http://www.estovest.net/letture/omero.html

    Felice Vinci, Omero nel Baltico
    Fratelli Palombi, Roma 1995; II ed. 1998

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    I am pretty sure that it happened, but probably not as portrayed in myth.

    Most wars really are not "exciting" or "fun" in reality. So writers add that fictional element to keep people interested in reading. There are real stories in every battle, of course, but always the victors write their version of the story, and the losers/defeated sometimes do not or cannot.

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    The fall of Troy VII is pretty well based on archaeological data that suggest that atleast one greater fire hazard destroyed large parts of the complex. Whether this was due to Greeks hiding in a big wooden horse is open for discussion.
    Last edited by Azvarohi; 2010-09-10 at 20:34.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Unome View Post
    I am pretty sure that it happened, but probably not as portrayed in myth.

    Most wars really are not "exciting" or "fun" in reality. So writers add that fictional element to keep people interested in reading. There are real stories in every battle, of course, but always the victors write their version of the story, and the losers/defeated sometimes do not or cannot.
    Now that you mention it, if it was true the good ones were the defeated, Troyans had a rich culture and a egalitarian almost-democratic society while the invaders were salvages, it is interesting that according to the legend Aeneid, the last Toyan, became the first Italian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sean View Post
    Now that you mention it, if it was true the good ones were the defeated, Troyans had a rich culture and a egalitarian almost-democratic society while the invaders were salvages, it is interesting that according to the legend Aeneid, the last Toyan, became the first Italian.
    Greeks may have even pilfered a lot of their 'Culture' from Trojan ruins too…

    Just another possibility to consider.

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    Archaeological evidence is that there were wars at the site. The literary connection is more dubious though.

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    Well, Achilles was real and his temple and related sanctuary are also real.www.scribd.com/doc/124642/THE-TEMPLE-OF-ACHILLES
    Man will only be truly free when the last stone from the last church/temple/mosque falls on the last priest/rabbi/imam!

    "E Zola"

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