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Thread: Witchy Witchiness and Witches3523 days old

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    Default Witchy Witchiness and Witches

    I have recently read some things on the European witch hunts, specifically those from Scotland and England, and I have been attempting to digest the material I have read.

    It would be interesting to see what folks from the Isle's have to say on the matters of the witch hunts in England and Scotland.

    I am curious how much the issues of witchcraft affected the lower class populations as all the readings I have read seem to revolve around the nobility or those associated with the nobility, examples being the accusations of David Seton deputy-bailiff of Tranent, and King James VI personal involvement in the forensic approaches to the witch trials.

    Do the school's in the England and Scotland touch on this subject? And how much of it influences the modern lives of the people in England and Scotland?

    ---------- Post added 2010-03-01 at 04:46 ----------

    I am also curious about the personal views of the average man in regards to how the trials were conducted. The writer of News from Scotland seemed to agree with all that took place judging from excerpts like:

    “let this suffice: that first, it is well known that the king is a child and servant of God, and they but servants to the devil; he is the lord’s anointed, and they but the vessels of God’s wrath; he is a true Christian and trusteth in God, they worse than infidels” (News from Scotland, pg. 16).
    The writer I judge to be a voice of the people as the overall tone of the writing seems editorial in nature, akin to a modern news anchor. As the voice of the people would the author be representing the people accurately by showing such support to King and conduct of the King and council during these trials?
    Last edited by cadwallon; 2010-03-01 at 04:47.

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    Well from what I have read, as women were making social and political progress in Europe, and slowly shifting into the areas of power. People who were threatened such as the Church institutions and as well the politicians used the theory that these women are witches and need to be burned. Witches in Medieval Europe were believed to have their powers come from the devil, and even had sexual relationships. Sometimes the Devil would mark his followers, by scar or tit as its called often on hidden places.

    This era is often referred to as the Female Holocaust.

    you might find this link is interesting but in general its about Europe

    http://www.gendercide.org/case_witchhunts.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nephilim View Post
    Well from what I have read, as women were making social and political progress in Europe, and slowly shifting into the areas of power. People who were threatened such as the Church institutions and as well the politicians used the theory that these women are witches and need to be burned. Witches in Medieval Europe were believed to have their powers come from the devil, and even had sexual relationships. Sometimes the Devil would mark his followers, by scar or tit as its called often on hidden places.

    This era is often referred to as the Female Holocaust.

    you might find this link is interesting but in general its about Europe

    http://www.gendercide.org/case_witchhunts.html
    I also noted that many of these females seemed to be generic healers and such and that many of the accusations against them were based on the "mysterious" ways that they cured people, an example being the case of Gellis Duncan, who was accused of witchcraft by the very same David Seton I mentioned earlier.

    In regards to that scenario I am curious if there was some competition between local medical specialists and Geillis, the full history behind the accusations were not presented by the author of News from Scotland, the author just did a general background it seems.

    It would make sense that there may have been some local medical specialists who felt threatened by the activities of Geillis and that they could have bribed or goaded David Seton into accusing her.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cadwallon View Post
    I also noted that many of these females seemed to be generic healers and such and that many of the accusations against them were based on the "mysterious" ways that they cured people, an example being the case of Gellis Duncan, who was accused of witchcraft by the very same David Seton I mentioned earlier.

    In regards to that scenario I am curious if there was some competition between local medical specialists and Geillis, the full history behind the accusations were not presented by the author of News from Scotland, the author just did a general background it seems.

    It would make sense that there may have been some local medical specialists who felt threatened by the activities of Geillis and that they could have bribed or goaded David Seton into accusing her.

    Yes very interesting their is also a parallel between the same situation that occurred in Salem witch trials in the U.S. The most women that were targeted seemed to have wealth or some form of power.

    That could the most likely scenario a competition of power.

    The easiest way was to damn person in such hyper religious societies was to associate them with witchcraft which itself was seen to be form of Satanism. It was the worst thing anyone can do.

    This also to justify the murder of those individuals.

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    I am curious if there are still witch accusations being made in modern rural Scotland or England, I know in the the rural U.S. there are still those who are making such accusations and in the Bible Belt such matters are considered to be valid as dictated by the emphasis on Christian religion in the region.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cadwallon View Post
    I am curious if there are still witch accusations being made in modern rural Scotland or England, I know in the the rural U.S. there are still those who are making such accusations and in the Bible Belt such matters are considered to be valid as dictated by the emphasis on Christian religion in the region.
    I believe the Europeans unlike their Americans cousins, have turned much atheistic in their believes and no longer for such things. Unlike the Americans who are more conservative and religious. The British have in some many ways divorced themselves from religion. So probably not.

    In the U.S Christianity is very strong and so are its conservative values. Comparing the the moral values of the U.S to that of Britain their is huge contrast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cadwallon View Post
    I am curious if there are still witch accusations being made in modern rural Scotland or England, I know in the the rural U.S. there are still those who are making such accusations and in the Bible Belt such matters are considered to be valid as dictated by the emphasis on Christian religion in the region.
    Some people have made quite a bit of money by falsely claiming to have been involved in secret, wealthy covens and/or cults. They conned a lot of conservative Christians, who seemed to be quite susceptible to buying these kinds of hoaxes. Mike Warnke was one of the first cons to do this. I'd guess that twenty to a hundred "ex members of x" followed in his crooked footsteps.

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    Default Salem Witch Trials

    Quote Originally Posted by Nephilim View Post
    Yes very interesting their is also a parallel between the same situation that occurred in Salem witch trials in the U.S. The most women that were targeted seemed to have wealth or some form of power.
    The biggest fact about the Salem witch trials was the entire event was started by a group of teenage girls who were misbehaving. Once caught they used temper tantrums and hystrionics to convince the elders that the real culprits were "witches".

    Madness ensued and the truth is that the week, poor, disenfranchised, different and old were accused. Later those that began to see reason were thrown under the witchcraft bus.

    All in all most people in that event died in jail or lost everything they had.

    It was finally one man, one of the Mathers, who said enough was enough and ordered the trials to stop.

    During the years after the plague in Europe "Man", who saw things in pure forms of black and white, determined that all bad that happened to humanity was the work of the devil, Hence a scapegoat had to be found. It couldn't be the lawmakers, or the educated or the rich so it had to be the women, who held none of those positions.

    Anyone who was different, stirred the pot, or looked funny and lived alone was suspet of signing their name in the book of evil. Anyone could accuse anyone they didn't like.

    After all the commotion those in charge started to target animals. Cats were put to death by the millions because they were the familiars of the witches. Funny thing... you kill enough cats, the rodent population rises and by 1666 or so you have another plague. Rodents - cats = plague + fire of London = rebirth of a city.

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