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Thread: Bell Beakers, Gimbutas and R1b1101 days old

  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arch Hades View Post
    These are estimates based on ADMIXTURE runs you've done or just an educated guess off the top of your head?

    Though I think your Armenian estimate is sound, the Lazardis paper did have other caucuses groups around that much. Armenians don't have any WHG do they?

    So basically the Karelian hunter gatherers would be both significantly more Eastern and Northern shifted on a Eurasian genome plot than modern Finns? Wow dude you're scaring the wog out of me.
    Their ANE estimates: Abkhasian 18.6%, Chechen 27%, Lezgin 28.8%.

    My estimates are similar, but the Abkhasians show more ANE, and the Chechens and Lezgins less. However, I tested more samples than them.

    More info...

    ANE is the primary cause of west to east genetic differentiation across West Eurasia


    The fateful triangle

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    Gimbutas was right! The autosomal and the yDNA of the Bell Beakers show a clear association with Yamnaya.

    I ordered the table provided on the page 26 of the recent study on them (Haak et al, 2015) so that it would be easier to read it. It includes the old samples too, and a comparison to EHG and WHG.

    Top 10 matches (the 10 genetically closest to Yamnaya; autosomal DNA), including the ancient samples:

    1-Corded_Ware_LN 0.011
    2-Unetice_EBA 0.012
    3-BenzigerodeHeimburg/Bell Beaker 0.013
    4-Bell_Beaker_LN 0.016

    5-Mordovian 0.018
    6-Lezgian/Russian 0.019
    7-Czech/Belarusian/Estonian/Hungarian/Icelandic 0.020
    8-Norwegian/English 0.021
    9-Croatian/French/Lithuanian/Orcadian 0.022
    10-Bulgarian 0.023
    They list Benzingerode-Heimburg culture as Bell Beaker:

    I0059 Bell Beaker? LN Benzingerode-Heimburg, Germany; BZH6, grave 2, feature/find 1287/1036 2286-2153 cal BCE (MAMS 21486) Germany F H1 /H1b'ad 241081
    I0058 BenzigerodeHeimburg_LN Bell Beaker LN Benzingerode-Heimburg, Germany; BZH4, grave 7, feature 4607 2283-2146 cal BCE (MAMS 21491) Germany F H1e 246728
    I0171 BenzigerodeHeimburg_LN Bell Beaker?

    Genetic samples including all of the samples shown, ancient and modern:

    Armenian 0.030
    Baalberge_MN 0.054
    Basque 0.034
    BedouinB 0.060
    Belarusian 0.020
    Bell_Beaker_LN 0.016
    BenzigerodeHeimburg_LN 0.013
    Bergamo 0.028
    Bulgarian 0.023
    Corded_Ware_LN 0.011
    Croatian 0.022
    Czech 0.020
    EHG 0.028
    English 0.021
    Estonian 0.020
    French 0.022
    Greek 0.026
    Han 0.118
    Hungarian 0.020
    HungaryGamba_BA 0.023
    HungaryGamba_EN 0.050
    Icelandic 0.020
    Iraqi_Jew 0.037
    Karitiana 0.204
    LBK_ 0.052
    Lezgin 0.019
    Lithuanian 0.022
    Mala 0.056
    Mordovian 0.018
    Motala_HG 0.063
    Norwegian 0.021
    Onge 0.178
    Orcadian 0.022
    Papuan 0.197
    Russian 0.019
    Sardinian 0.044
    Sicilian 0.030
    Sindhi 0.028
    Spain_EN 0.060
    Spain_MN 0.053
    Spanish 0.027
    SwedenSkoglund_NHG 0.062
    Turkish 0.026
    Unetice_EBA 0.012
    WHG 0.076
    The 10 closest modern groups to Yamnaya (out of the samples they tested, of course):

    1-Mordovian 0.018
    2-Lezgian/Russian 0.019
    3- Czech/Belarusian/Estonian/Hungarian/Icelandic 0.020
    4-Norwegian/English 0.021
    5-Croatian/French/Lithuanian/Orcadian 0.022
    6- Bulgarian 0.023
    7- Greek/Turkish 0.026
    8-Spanish 0.027
    9- Sindhi/Bergamo 0.028
    10- Armenian/Sicilian 0.030
    Last edited by Ubirajara; 2015-02-16 at 14:08.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ubirajara View Post
    Not if you look at the older clades distribution (the clades found in Western Europe are the newest, not the oldest; the one which accounts for the vast majority of Iberian R1b, for example, is R1b-SS12 and its subclades, which is fairly recent):

    Where's this map from and who made it?
    ReactOS <--- support this project so that we can get rid of Windows!
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    “A wise man makes his own decisions; an ignorant man follows public opinion.” ― Chinese proverb

    “Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under.” ― H. L. Mencken

    “The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance.” ― Socrates

    “Damnant quod non intelligunt.” ― Latin proverb

    Quoted for truth:
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaron View Post
    Anatolian Urhemait supporters are mostly butthurt Meds.
    For the lulz:
    Quote Originally Posted by drgs View Post
    Poland is a misunderstanding. It is a country which lies on the frontier between western and slavic world, and which combines elements of both.
    In fact, they are not even the Europeans in strict sense, meaning European as in bearing the responsibility and understanding of European interests. Poland has always been an subordinate country, on one side sucking German dick, on the other side -- Russian one, some kind of "novice" europeans, who are full of inferiority complexes, hysteria and obsessity neuroses. This is also true for all Baltic countries

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    Quote Originally Posted by EliasAlucard View Post
    Where's this map from and who made it?
    It comes from the now defunct DNA forum or from eupedia, I am not sure. I guess I saved it at DNA Forum.
    Last edited by Ubirajara; 2015-02-16 at 16:55.
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    Last edited by Silesian; 2017-08-12 at 00:49.

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