User Tag List

Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 32

Thread: Turkey's free speech problem...1593 days old

  1. #1
    Senior Moderator
    Plant of Life = Biological Magic 麻 EliasAlucard's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2009-10-22
    Posts
    14,709
    Location
    Sweden
    Gender
    Age
    34
    Y-DNA
    J1a2a1a2-P58+
    mtDNA
    H5a
    Race
    Caucasian
    Phenotype
    Alpinid
    Metaethnos
    proto-Semitic
    Ethnicity
    Assyrian/Armenian
    Politics
    Environment, Cannabis
    Religion
    Secular Agnostic
    Assyria Assyria 1913-1923 Armenia Lebanon Sweden Greece

    Default Turkey's free speech problem...

    Aside from the now longwithstanding Turkish Penal Code, aka Article 301, which prohibits “insulting Turkishness”, Turkey is now at it again:

    Turkey threatens Google with ban over hostage image: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-32194913

    This has of course become a monthly routine by now, that every now and then, Turkey threatens to ban or bans Twitter, YouTube and so on. For every time it happens, it becomes more and more ridiculous, because the stuff Turkey wants removed from the web is usually something along the lines that Atatürk wasn't sacrosanct enough. Of course the underlying mechanism behind Turkey's behavior is mental midgetry, and that its politicians take their "honor" a bit too seriously, which is the norm in the Islamo-Arab world. However, Turkey is a quasi-Western country, or pretends like it is a Western country anyway (it's not, and it never has been either), so Turkey's standards should be a bit higher than the rest of the Islamic world.

    I think the best solution is to not give a damn about what Turkey thinks, and just let its politicians ban Twitter, YouTube, Google and everything else Turkey doesn't think qualifies to its rigid censorship demands. The best solution really would be to entirely exclude Turkey from Western civilization altogether. The Turkish regime being pro-ISIS, anti-Christian and generally speaking super corrupt, has proven to us all that it's simply not qualified to be part of the Western world. There's no good reason why the civilized world should respect Turkey, because the Turkish regime has no self-respect in the first place; a government that is anti-free speech and pro-Islamic State of Iraq and Syria, that's a country that should be marginalized in every way possible.

    Topic questions:
    What can be done about about the Turkish regime's threat to free speech? Why aren't various social media websites just ignoring Turkey? Why do Western politicians care about catering to demands from pro-Islamic Turkish politicians?
    Last edited by EliasAlucard; 2015-04-07 at 14:50.
    ReactOS <--- support this project so that we can get rid of Windows!
    Ubuntu MATE 16.04.1 LTS | PRISM-Break! | Windows7sins

    “A wise man makes his own decisions; an ignorant man follows public opinion.” ― Chinese proverb

    “Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under.” ― H. L. Mencken

    “The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance.” ― Socrates

    “Damnant quod non intelligunt.” ― Latin proverb

    Quoted for truth:
    Quote Originally Posted by Alaron View Post
    Anatolian Urhemait supporters are mostly butthurt Meds.
    For the lulz:
    Quote Originally Posted by drgs View Post
    Poland is a misunderstanding. It is a country which lies on the frontier between western and slavic world, and which combines elements of both.
    In fact, they are not even the Europeans in strict sense, meaning European as in bearing the responsibility and understanding of European interests. Poland has always been an subordinate country, on one side sucking German dick, on the other side -- Russian one, some kind of "novice" europeans, who are full of inferiority complexes, hysteria and obsessity neuroses. This is also true for all Baltic countries

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to EliasAlucard For This Useful Post:

    beyw (2015-04-07), Janos (2015-04-07), Semitic Duwa (2015-04-07)

  3. # ADS
    Advertisement bot
    Join Date
    2013-03-24
    Location
    ForumBiodiversity.com
    Age
    2010
    Posts
    All threads
       
     

  4. #2
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Acquisitorz's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2011-04-16
    Posts
    6,361
    Location
    Belgium
    Gender
    Politics
    Liberal
    Religion
    Lol
    Flanders lion Israel Russia

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EliasAlucard View Post

    Topic questions:
    What can be done about about the Turkish regime's threat to free speech? Why aren't various social media websites just ignoring Turkey? Why do Western politicians care about catering to demands from pro-Islamic Turkish politicians?
    Turkey's path to secularism is clouded, the current regime is a serious bump on the road. Yet the process is already irreversible, Turkey will be the first Islamic country which becomes secular, Islam will be a distant memory in Turkey, eventually, just as Christianity is a distant memory in Sweden/Belgium etc.

    Social media sites can't ignore such a market for one simple reason: imagine fb/twitter/youtube etc is permanently banned in Turkey. That could create space for a local clones to be developed, these clones can take over the local market first and then spill over to other markets, particularly islamic markets. twitter/fb/youtube etc cant risk that.
    Last edited by Acquisitorz; 2015-04-07 at 16:45.

  5. #3
    QBS Banned
    Molecular Biologist
    Last Online
    2015-12-05 @ 01:33
    Join Date
    2012-11-09
    Posts
    320
    Gender
    Age
    38

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Acquisitorz View Post
    Turkey's path to secularism is clouded, the current regime is a serious bump on the road. Yet the process is already irreversible, Turkey will be the first Islamic country which becomes secular, Islam will be a distant memory in Turkey, eventually, just as Christianity is a distant memory in Sweden/Belgium etc.

    Social media sites can't ignore such a market for one simple reason: imagine fb/twitter/youtube etc is permanently banned in Turkey. That could create space for a local clones to be developed, these clones can take over the local market first and then spill over to other markets, particularly islamic markets. twitter/fb/youtube etc cant risk that.
    I don't think you are making a good comparison here, you are comparing apples to oranges when it comes to the two religions. Islam is not Christianity, it doesn't meld/mold itself to new ideas or to anything that is not structurally part of the religion itself; when Islam sees something that is antithetical and non-parochial in nature, which also does not tow along the lines of absolutism as a rigid religion like that does, then it seeks to destroy it by nature of it's absolutist design.

    Islam was carefully designed so that it would continuously and perpetually stay in the psychs and structural foundations of any society it took over, so it that sense it's not really a religion but also an economical and socio-political pseudo-idea of government and organizing society that extends beyond religion.

    Once one understands that, then the pieces comes together and it starts to make sense why Islam has continuously kept it's numbers intact, why there are still so many of them in these regions in the first place, and why it has simply not disappeared into the background. That's why Islamic countries are usually also backwards and poor, so that the religion keeps perpetuating itself like a perpetual machine by keeping the masses in a certain mental cognitive state so that religion keeps continuing. It's almost like a virus, any change that seeks to take Islam into the dustbin memory of society and turn it into background noise, will be attacked by this virus.

    Unfortunately Islamic style anti-intellectual/anti-progressive/anti-civilization thinking is so enmeshed into countries like Turkey that it's going to take thousands of years/centuries just to let it go. That's counting on the fact that there is is a consistency of centuries of trying to re-engineer society and change it to gravitate away from medieval backwards thinking, which I don't think any MENA country is really capable of pulling off right now.

    I also don't think that these countries are actually capable of creating social media clones of youtube/twitter/fb etc or online ideas and programs that is up to the caliber or on a level of surpassing these sorts of online programs. The intellectual horsepower just doesn't exist there and that's why they are backwards and Islamic in the first place. If they do, it will just be shitty 2nd rate versions of them and google/youtube etc won't have trouble pushing them away.


    These are the same people that are willing to believe that Muslims discovered America first and shooting meteorites are god popping demons out of the sky, such people are just not capable of creating complicated internet architecture or the next big thing in tech! Hell most Turks ARE NOT REAL TURKS!

    They are not Mongoloid gooks from Central Asia! Yet they follow a culture and language imposed on them by chance from Gooks from Central Asia and actually believe they are majority genetically related to them and actually created that culture! This while believing in an anachronous barbaric religion that evolved out of a Arabian desert region that has rigid backwards rules that only applies to a certain time period and not meant to be taken literally, and which the vast portion of Turks just can't seem to grasp this idea!
    Last edited by Eyptianknight; 2015-04-07 at 19:04.

  6. #4
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Acquisitorz's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2011-04-16
    Posts
    6,361
    Location
    Belgium
    Gender
    Politics
    Liberal
    Religion
    Lol
    Flanders lion Israel Russia

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eyptianknight View Post
    I don't think you are making a good comparison here, you are comparing apples to oranges when it comes to the two religions. Islam is not Christianity, it doesn't meld/mold itself to new ideas or to anything that is not structurally part of the religion itself; when Islam sees something that is antithetical and non-parochial in nature, which also does not tow along the lines of absolutism as a rigid religion like that does, then it seeks to destroy it by nature of it's absolutist design. -!
    I did not compare Islam to Christianity. I simply said that eventually it will be a part of history. However clever the Islam trap is, it's still a leaking one, there still a way out. Many Turks are either completely secular or alcohol drinking, randomly fucking, pot smoking "muslims" who are muslims on paper only, but not in their minds.

    Turkey is a great example to see how Islam is failing, violent ups in an otherwise hopeless downtrend of Islam in that country. The process is long and if Ataturk deserves any of the glory he still enjoys then its for setting this all in motion. He knew what he was doing, and he did it rather well, he destroyed the basement and the building is falling apart.

    Something tells me that Erdogan is scared, he is scared to lose it eventually. His nation has taken a sip of the sweet nectar of secularism and its not going back to where it came from, despite of his best efforts.

    If Edrogan thought he could limit Twitter, fb, youtube etc without any risk to his position then he would have done so long ago, but he can't risk it. That alone shows how far the body of Islam has decomposed.
    Last edited by Acquisitorz; 2015-04-07 at 19:28.

  7. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Acquisitorz For This Useful Post:

    El Andullero (2015-04-07), Windischer (2015-04-07)

  8. #5
    QBS Banned
    Molecular Biologist
    Last Online
    2015-12-05 @ 01:33
    Join Date
    2012-11-09
    Posts
    320
    Gender
    Age
    38

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Acquisitorz View Post
    I did not compare Islam to Christianity. I simply said that eventually it will be a part of history. However clever the Islam trap is, it's still a leaking one, there still a way out. Many Turks are either completely secular or alcohol drinking, randomly fucking, pot smoking "muslims" who are muslims on paper only, but not in their minds.

    Turkey is a great example to see how Islam is failing, violent ups in an otherwise hopeless downtrend of Islam in that country. The process is long and if Ataturk deserves any of the glory he still enjoys then its for setting this all in motion. He knew what he was doing, and he did it rather well, he destroyed the basement and the building is falling apart.

    Something tells me that Erdogan is scared, he is scared to lose it eventually. His nation has taken a sip of the sweet nectar of secularism and its not going back to where it came from, despite of his best efforts.

    If Edrogan thought he could limit Twitter, fb, youtube etc without any risk to his position then he would have done so long ago, but he can't risk it. That alone shows how far the body of Islam has decomposed.
    I'm assuming you are talking about Western Turkey right? Islam seems to be failing presently in Turkey because just by circumstances alone; there happened to be a culture and a civilization that predated that, that sort of resisted fully succumbing to Islam, but there is a large portion in the East and the diaspora in places like Germany that show that the backwards thinking is not going to completely go away. You were saying Islam would simply disappear just like Christanity and I'm saying that it's not true and you are making an invalid assertion there.

    Hell a lot of people in Islamic countries drink alcohol, I've heard in Afghanistan they smuggle alcohol to drink and they like engaging in gay sex!! It's even almost part of the culture there to do this! Does that man that prism is going to go away? As long as the U.S/West keeps what it's doing right now and simply just exists/floats, then there is always going to be that reactionary anti-intellectual pseudo-Islamic myopic prism thinking, no matter how much pot Turks smoke and how EE sex slaves they try to import. Many of the Islamic Sultans in the Ottomon empire repeatedly followed non-Muslim behavior, and yet they still called themselves Muslims and perpetuated the religion there.

    There isn't much hope for intellectualism in most of the MENA regions anyway. Erdogen needs not to fear anything anyway, he can simply point towards the "decadent West", as so many Islamic retards do online, as say "hey if we end up following them, we could end up like them, therefore more Islam is the solution towards falling birth rates and cultural decadence!" or "hey the West seems degenerate, so Islam seems like a better conservative option!".

    And voila! People fall for it and see an "opposite" to the "weak decadent west". This is the argument people are using in comments board and so many of people of the "alternative right" (lol) fall for it!
    Last edited by Eyptianknight; 2015-04-07 at 20:02.

  9. #6
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Acquisitorz's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2011-04-16
    Posts
    6,361
    Location
    Belgium
    Gender
    Politics
    Liberal
    Religion
    Lol
    Flanders lion Israel Russia

    Default

    I'm assuming you are talking about Western Turkey right? Islam seems to be failing presently in Turkey because just by circumstances alone; there happened to be a culture and a civilization that predated that, that sort of resisted fully succumbing to Islam, but there is a large portion in the East and the diaspora in places like Germany that show that the backwards thinking is not going to completely go away. You were saying Islam would simply disappear just like Christanity and I'm saying that it's not true and you are making an invalid assertion there.
    Here is a surprise: the backwards thinking doesn't completely go away, anywhere in the world.

    Places where Christianity was very strong still have dumbfucks living in them, an average IQ in the world is like 100 meaning that half of the population falls below that level.

    I still fail to see a single reason why Islam is not going to disappear like Christianity had. Purely based on your thoughts.

    It appears you are looking at the present where this cancer is still strong, but if you look at the bigger picture you'll see that its declining. In Turkey at least.

    There isn't much hope for intellectualism in most of the MENA regions anyway. Erdogen needs not to fear anything anyway, he can simply point towards the "decadent West", as so many Islamic retards do online, as say "hey if we end up following them, we could end up like them, therefore more Islam is the solution towards falling birth rates and cultural decadence!" or "hey the West seems degenerate, so Islam seems like a better conservative option!".
    There is always hope for everything, including the MENA region. Again, look at the bigger picture, while the region is filled with idiocy, it still can and will change eventually.

    Erdogan undoubtedly has an army of supporters who will look at any direction his finger is pointing at.

    But there is rationalism present in that society, the same rationalism which helped to create a growing economy, which is quite strong for an Islamic country without natural resources.

    The glass is not necessarily half empty, it can also be seen as half full.

  10. #7
    QBS Banned
    Molecular Biologist
    Last Online
    2015-12-05 @ 01:33
    Join Date
    2012-11-09
    Posts
    320
    Gender
    Age
    38

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Acquisitorz View Post
    Here is a surprise: the backwards thinking doesn't completely go away, anywhere in the world.

    Places where Christianity was very strong still have dumbfucks living in them, an average IQ in the world is like 100 meaning that half of the population falls below that level.

    I still fail to see a single reason why Islam is not going to disappear like Christianity had. Purely based on your thoughts.

    It appears you are looking at the present where this cancer is still strong, but if you look at the bigger picture you'll see that its declining. In Turkey at least.



    There is always hope for everything, including the MENA region. Again, look at the bigger picture, while the region is filled with idiocy, it still can and will change eventually.

    Erdogan undoubtedly has an army of supporters who will look at any direction his finger is pointing at.

    But there is rationalism present in that society, the same rationalism which helped to create a growing economy, which is quite strong for an Islamic country without natural resources.

    The glass is not necessarily half empty, it can also be seen as half full.
    You don't get it because you still don't understand Islam, Islam is not a religion but you are saying it is. It's clearly more then that!


    Just out of topic, I was seeing someone else commenting that for most of history most of the MENA regions were ahead of the general Western world and the Europe. I have heard this many many times, this particular individual then stated that the Ottoman Empire was able to control the balkans and vast portions of Eastern Europe, and reach Central Europe because they were more advanced and more high tech then the West at the time. Is this really true or was this just a freak occurrence that all this shit happened? It's claimed that the Ottoman empire was generally ahead and up to par with the West for most of history.

    All this stuff true or liberal hogwash?

  11. #8
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Acquisitorz's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2011-04-16
    Posts
    6,361
    Location
    Belgium
    Gender
    Politics
    Liberal
    Religion
    Lol
    Flanders lion Israel Russia

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eyptianknight View Post
    Just out of topic, I was seeing someone else commenting that for most of history most of the MENA regions were ahead of the general Western world and the Europe. I have heard this many many times, this particular individual then stated that the Ottoman Empire was able to control the balkans and vast portions of Eastern Europe, and reach Central Europe because they were more advanced and more high tech then the West at the time. Is this really true or was this just a freak occurrence that all this shit happened? It's claimed that the Ottoman empire was generally ahead and up to par with the West for most of history.
    so what's the point you are making?

    even if the Ottoman empire was idd ahead of other regions at some point of history, what does it mean for the present or for the future?

    if the point is that reestablishing the empire will make it far more developed that the rest of the world then its not going to happen; just as resurrecting the Roman empire which was also way ahead of the rest back then, will not make it the leader again.

    The Ottoman empire existed, left legacy and disappeared, just as many other empires before it.

    Europe/US as the leaders of the world will have their peak or have already had it, but the legacy of their success will live on.

  12. #9
    Established Member
    Zumurd-i sudah Zert's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2010-07-30
    Posts
    1,363
    Location
    Absurdistan
    Gender
    Age
    27
    Metaethnos
    Iranic
    Ethnicity
    Kurd
    Religion
    None (Atheism)
    Kurdistan Belgium Flanders lion Armenia

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eyptianknight View Post
    You don't get it because you still don't understand Islam, Islam is not a religion but you are saying it is. It's clearly more then that!

    Just out of topic, I was seeing someone else commenting that for most of history most of the MENA regions were ahead of the general Western world and the Europe. I have heard this many many times, this particular individual then stated that the Ottoman Empire was able to control the balkans and vast portions of Eastern Europe, and reach Central Europe because they were more advanced and more high tech then the West at the time. Is this really true or was this just a freak occurrence that all this shit happened? It's claimed that the Ottoman empire was generally ahead and up to par with the West for most of history.

    All this stuff true or liberal hogwash?
    It was quite impressive, I have to admit, but also in an entirely other environment than the European powers of the time. Europe was a total clusterfuck of many nations in a small area, monarchies that extended control through marriage, militias, high amount of specializations, and in an almost constant state of war. Not to say that the Ottomans didn't fight many wars, but their population was more loyal (Islamic legitimacy), it had fewer rivals (big ones though, in the form of Russians and Safavids), and knew to establish itself in a power vacuum.

    This allowed it to grow in size and strength, but also would become its downfall. The many wars and movements of Europe led to an arms race the likes which had never been seen before, military tactics, a growing economic competitiveness, high exchange of knowledge and talent. Of course, the Industrial Revolution and nationalism can't be forgotten in this matter. The first allows mass production, the latter molds a more war-ready, proud population.

    The Ottomans in the 19th century, on the other hand, were severely lagging behind in technological advances, military knowledge and tactics, and were very overstretched and short of funds, ultimately resulting in its downfall. Doesn't take away that it had an impressive history of more than six centuries though.

  13. #10
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist Acquisitorz's Avatar
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2011-04-16
    Posts
    6,361
    Location
    Belgium
    Gender
    Politics
    Liberal
    Religion
    Lol
    Flanders lion Israel Russia

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eyptianknight View Post
    You don't get it because you still don't understand Islam, Islam is not a religion but you are saying it is. It's clearly more then that!
    have you studied the European history?

    have you read (and maybe watched documentaries) about what people were doing on this continent in the name of Christianity in the medieval period?

    exactly the same as the most disgusting Islamic regimes are doing now.

    I bet free thinkers back then also thought it was hopeless, but here we are, in the post Christian era of Europe.

    Those free thinkers teleported to modern Europe from lets say 600 years ago would say "now I can die in peace, knowing that this idiocy will eventually end".

    People like our Awale here are exactly the same, locked in an ocean of insanity, knowing that there is hope.

Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. there is no identification problem for mixed background but an acceptance problem
    By AkhandBharat in forum Race & Ethnicity in Society
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 2012-06-06, 04:36
  2. Abusing the right to free speech
    By Helios in forum Philosophy
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 2011-10-06, 18:08
  3. "Insulting Turkishness"? Anti-free speech policy of Turkey
    By EliasAlucard in forum Nationalism & Fascism
    Replies: 193
    Last Post: 2010-05-09, 04:02
  4. Free Speech Area: Your favorite Mohammed Cartoon
    By Holden Caulfield in forum Religion
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 2010-03-30, 11:22

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
<