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Thread: Comparison of MENA minorities1197 days old

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    Default Comparison of MENA minorities

    So I found myself bored and decided to compare some MENA minority groups to see how their admixture differed from each other, and how it stayed the same. I used MDLP K13 as its spreadsheet had the most samples.

    Assyrian
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 21.72
    Arctic -
    ASI 0.80
    Caucas-Gedrosia 43.91
    EastAsian -
    ENF 16.52
    NearEast 16.29
    Oceanian -
    Paleo-African -
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 0.38
    WHG-UHG 0.38


    Lebanese Christian
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 12.36
    Arctic -
    ASI 0.75
    Caucas-Gedrosia 38.99
    EastAsian -
    ENF 24.97
    NearEast 21.79
    Oceanian -
    Paleo-African 0.29
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 0.84
    WHG-UHG 0.02


    Lebanese Druze
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 15.37
    Arctic -
    ASI 0.87
    Caucas-Gedrosia 37.20
    EastAsian -
    ENF 23.75
    NearEast 20.36
    Oceanian 0.01
    Paleo-African 0.31
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 1.19
    WHG-UHG 0.93



    Samaritan
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 11.71
    Arctic -
    ASI -
    Caucas-Gedrosia 37.32
    EastAsian -
    ENF 25.01
    NearEast 23.05
    Oceanian -
    Paleo-African -
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 2.84
    WHG-UHG -


    Christian-Arabs-Israel/Palestinian Christian
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 9.60
    Arctic 0.96
    ASI -
    Caucas-Gedrosia 36.63
    EastAsian -
    ENF 27.78
    NearEast 21.63
    Oceanian -
    Paleo-African -
    Siberian -
    Sub-Saharan 3.04
    WHG-UHG 0.29

    Egyptian copt
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 2.63
    Arctic -
    ASI -
    Caucas-Gedrosia 29.99
    EastAsian -
    ENF 23.17
    NearEast 31.74
    Oceanian 0.28
    Paleo-African -
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 12.19
    WHG-UHG -

    Just through a brief glance, the results seem to strongly coincide with geography, with Assyrians having the highest Caucas-Gedrosia, ANE and lowest Sub-saharan, and copts being the opposite. The fact that Palestinian christians and Samaritans are so closely related is very interesting too, it strongly raises the argument that Palestinian Christians are simply descendants of those first Jews who converted to Christianity.

    Other than Assyrians, it also seems that ENF admixture is mostly consistent throughout the groups, with no clear pattern forming, which is pretty interesting. Anyone else have any observations?
    Last edited by nee4speed111; 2016-05-09 at 13:50.

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    The main pattern is that as the Caucas-Gedrosia goes down, the NearEast and Subsaharian go up.
    K=47 Results
    78.92% African
    • 59.05% West-African
    • 8.36% Central-African_HG
    • 3.32% East-African_HG
    • 2.22% Nilotic
    • 2.11% Omotic(?)
    • 1.78% Sahelian
    • 1.05% South-African_HG
    • 1.03% Kushitic(?)

    11.84% West Eurasian
    • 3.79% North-Sea_Germanic
    • 2.15% East-Euro
    • 1.39% Scando-Germanic
    • 1.26% Paleo-Balkan
    • 0.88% Central-Med
    • 0.54% NW-Indian(?)
    • 0.42% East-Iberian
    • 0.39% Baltic
    • 0.14% West-Med
    • 0.17% North-Iberian
    • 0.02% East-Med

    9.92% Native/Indigenous to Americas
    • 4.59% Meso-Amerind
    • 2.14% Amazonian
    • 2.01% Andean
    • 1.15% North-Amerind
    • 0.02% South-Indian(?)
    • 0.01% Tibetan(?)

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    Yes agreed, It is very apparent.


    [TABLE="width: 500"]
    [TR]
    [TD][/TD]
    [TD]Caucas-Gedrosia+ANE [/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]Near Eastern+Subsaharan[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Assyrian[/TD]
    [TD]21.72+43.91=65.63[/TD]
    [TD]16.29+0.38=16.67[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Lebanese Christian[/TD]
    [TD]12.36+38.99=51.35[/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]21.79+0.84=22.63[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Lebanese Druze[/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]15.37+37.20=52.57[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD] 20.36+1.19=21.55[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Samaritan[/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]11.71+37.32=49.03[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]23.05+2.84=25.89[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Palestinian Christian[/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]9.60+36.63=46.23[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]21.63+3.04=24.67[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]Egyptian copt[/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]2.63+29.99=32.62[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [TD]
    [TR]
    [TD]31.74+12.19=43.93[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    Just looking at this table, all of the levantine groups seem broadly similar, while Assyrians and copts seem quite divergent.
    Last edited by nee4speed111; 2016-05-09 at 14:36.

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    Copts seem more intermediate to Levantine and Northeast African populations. Assyrians seem like they are originally from the Caucasus areas and related to Armenians and Georgians.
    K=47 Results
    78.92% African
    • 59.05% West-African
    • 8.36% Central-African_HG
    • 3.32% East-African_HG
    • 2.22% Nilotic
    • 2.11% Omotic(?)
    • 1.78% Sahelian
    • 1.05% South-African_HG
    • 1.03% Kushitic(?)

    11.84% West Eurasian
    • 3.79% North-Sea_Germanic
    • 2.15% East-Euro
    • 1.39% Scando-Germanic
    • 1.26% Paleo-Balkan
    • 0.88% Central-Med
    • 0.54% NW-Indian(?)
    • 0.42% East-Iberian
    • 0.39% Baltic
    • 0.14% West-Med
    • 0.17% North-Iberian
    • 0.02% East-Med

    9.92% Native/Indigenous to Americas
    • 4.59% Meso-Amerind
    • 2.14% Amazonian
    • 2.01% Andean
    • 1.15% North-Amerind
    • 0.02% South-Indian(?)
    • 0.01% Tibetan(?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by nee4speed111 View Post
    The fact that Palestinian christians and Samaritans are so closely related is very interesting too, it strongly raises the argument that Palestinian Christians are simply descendants of those first Jews who converted to Christianity.
    Palestinian Muslims in turn should be descended from the same, but they have extra Sub-Saharan and SW Asian which implies they do have Arab genes as well and likely Egyptian influence, too. The Lebanese Christians and Assyrians have low Sub-Saharan compared to the Palestinian Christian, who has significantly less than the Egyptian Copt.

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    I've found Palestinians Christians and Muslims on Gedmatch that were scoring like each other, and some even nearly identical to Samaritans. I've also found Palestinian Muslims that were significantly divergent. Some had pretty big amounts of African ancestry, one had a surname which would've suggested paternal origin in the north. His genome actually supported that, he looked pretty Iranic.

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    How are these ethnic/religious minorities differnt from the majorities in their countries? Less Arab admixture?

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    Quote Originally Posted by FinallyDeRico View Post
    I've found Palestinians Christians and Muslims on Gedmatch that were scoring like each other, and some even nearly identical to Samaritans. I've also found Palestinian Muslims that were significantly divergent. Some had pretty big amounts of African ancestry, one had a surname which would've suggested paternal origin in the north. His genome actually supported that, he looked pretty Iranic.
    Why do you believe Assyrians are such genetic outliers compared to Levant minorities?
    K=47 Results
    78.92% African
    • 59.05% West-African
    • 8.36% Central-African_HG
    • 3.32% East-African_HG
    • 2.22% Nilotic
    • 2.11% Omotic(?)
    • 1.78% Sahelian
    • 1.05% South-African_HG
    • 1.03% Kushitic(?)

    11.84% West Eurasian
    • 3.79% North-Sea_Germanic
    • 2.15% East-Euro
    • 1.39% Scando-Germanic
    • 1.26% Paleo-Balkan
    • 0.88% Central-Med
    • 0.54% NW-Indian(?)
    • 0.42% East-Iberian
    • 0.39% Baltic
    • 0.14% West-Med
    • 0.17% North-Iberian
    • 0.02% East-Med

    9.92% Native/Indigenous to Americas
    • 4.59% Meso-Amerind
    • 2.14% Amazonian
    • 2.01% Andean
    • 1.15% North-Amerind
    • 0.02% South-Indian(?)
    • 0.01% Tibetan(?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by pgbk87 View Post
    Copts seem more intermediate to Levantine and Northeast African populations. Assyrians seem like they are originally from the Caucasus areas and related to Armenians and Georgians.
    yeah agreed, the somali and Ethiopian results according to the spreadsheet are pretty interesting to compare.

    Ethiopian
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE 0.01
    Arctic -
    ASI 0.04
    Caucas-Gedrosia 10.74
    EastAsian 0.39
    ENF 12.88
    NearEast 31.89
    Oceanian 0.05
    Paleo-African 4.27
    Siberian -
    Subsaharian 39.72
    WHG-UHG

    Somali
    Population
    Amerindian -
    ANE
    Arctic -
    ASI 0.17
    Caucas-Gedrosia 5.82
    EastAsian 1.09
    ENF 11.08
    NearEast 29.08
    Oceanian -
    Paleo-African 3.32
    Siberian 0.26
    Subsaharian 49.13
    WHG-UHG

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by tauromenion View Post
    Palestinian Muslims in turn should be descended from the same, but they have extra Sub-Saharan and SW Asian which implies they do have Arab genes as well and likely Egyptian influence, too. The Lebanese Christians and Assyrians have low Sub-Saharan compared to the Palestinian Christian, who has significantly less than the Egyptian Copt.
    I just checked all of these samples on another calculator, and all of the SSA is purely East African/Northeast African, which is pretty interesting. I would have imagined that the Sub-Saharan in Palestinian christians came from coptic migrants, but the fact that samaritans have broadly similar amounts seems to disprove that.

    Seems more likely then, that its been in the Southern Levant for a long time, which makes sense since Egypt has conquered the levant for long periods of time before, and has had traders and merchants in it for a very long time.

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    Can you post the K36 results of those groups and compare it to these groups:
    https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...mF0/edit#gid=0
    K=47 Results
    78.92% African
    • 59.05% West-African
    • 8.36% Central-African_HG
    • 3.32% East-African_HG
    • 2.22% Nilotic
    • 2.11% Omotic(?)
    • 1.78% Sahelian
    • 1.05% South-African_HG
    • 1.03% Kushitic(?)

    11.84% West Eurasian
    • 3.79% North-Sea_Germanic
    • 2.15% East-Euro
    • 1.39% Scando-Germanic
    • 1.26% Paleo-Balkan
    • 0.88% Central-Med
    • 0.54% NW-Indian(?)
    • 0.42% East-Iberian
    • 0.39% Baltic
    • 0.14% West-Med
    • 0.17% North-Iberian
    • 0.02% East-Med

    9.92% Native/Indigenous to Americas
    • 4.59% Meso-Amerind
    • 2.14% Amazonian
    • 2.01% Andean
    • 1.15% North-Amerind
    • 0.02% South-Indian(?)
    • 0.01% Tibetan(?)

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