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Thread: Tollensee: 4000-warrior battle 1300 BC in Northern Germany93 days old

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wojewoda View Post
    Modern day so-called cult wagon:

    Last edited by Panthalika; 2017-11-03 at 17:56.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Panthalika View Post
    Modern day so-called cult wagon:

    “Those who were first to start using this technology usually emerged as the victors. The heavy plough represented the same advantage for regions where the soil was difficult to cultivate.”
    "How the heavy plough changed the world"

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    Last edited by Panthalika; 2017-11-03 at 18:35.

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    Last edited by NixYO; 2017-11-04 at 01:10.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wojewoda View Post
    Maybe that's why it was such a cult wagon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Panthalika View Post


    Clay soil is the first indicator – others follow

    ”Clay soil is known as luvisol. This is what we’re looking for and what tracking databases use,” says Andersen.

    Once the luvisol-rich land has been detected, the next unknown parameters pop up:

    Where exactly are the luvisol-poor soils? Developments in the early Middle Ages can then be compared with luvisol-rich regions.
    Where were the financial centres located – before and after the introduction of the heavy plough?
    How and when did urban centres and populations start growing?
    How might other factors – including other new technologies, political and historical factors – have affected the rise or fall of these centres?
    What do written sources say?
    "How the heavy plough changed the world"


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    Shares: These plough remains are of particular interest as they indicate whether the
    instrument was symmetrical or asymmetrical. An asymmetrical share would be consistent
    with the existence of heavy ploughs, but it has been suggested by Wailes (1972) that
    asymmetrical ards have existed. The earliest evidence of asymmetrical shares comes from
    Roman Britain where three such parts have been found (Manning 1964; Wailes 1972). Yet
    Manning (1964) argues that the bow ard was the normal plough of the period, as noted above.
    More systematic evidence on the evolution of shares is given in Henning (1987) for South
    Eastern Europe, which encompasses parts of the Balkans as well as Hungary and Slovakia.
    Henning shows that from the 3rd to the 6th century there is no systematic asymmetry in the
    shares found, but concludes that for the period from the 7th to the 10th century there is a
    strong “overweight of left-sided asymmetry” (1987, p. 55). This is consistent with White’s
    view that Slavic tribes had the heavy plough from around AD 600.
    Other asymmetrical shares
    are covered in Lerche (1994), where German and Czech findings of plough shares dating
    back to the 11th century or later are discussed. This is similar to the Danish evidence
    discussed by Larsen (2011) mentioned above.
    Linguistic evidence

    White (1962) argues that Slavs may have introduced the heavy plough and that it therefore
    diffused from east to west starting in the late 6th century.
    This conclusion was reached by
    considering evidence indicating that a word for plough and many associated terms existed in
    all of the three Slavic linguistic groups. More specifically, White (1962, p. 50) reasons that
    “since the Slavic vocabulary surrounding plug probably would have developed rapidly, once
    the Slavs got the heavy plough, we have no reason to date its arrival among them very long
    before the Avar Invasion of 568.” He also points out that the word ‘plough’ first appears in
    written form in 643 in Northern Italy as the Lombardian ‘plovum’ in the Langobaridan
    Edictus Rothari.

    For South Western Germany, the Lex Alemannorum shows that the word
    ‘carruca’ had come to mean a plough with two wheels in front by the 8th century. There is
    also written evidence for a heavy plough in Wales in the 10th century in the laws of Hywel
    Dda (White 1962, pp. 50-51). Puhvel (1964) notes that the word for plough (plogr) does not
    appear in old Norse before AD 1000, whence it probably spread to 11th century England,
    where ‘plog’ or ‘ploh’ replaced the older word ‘sulh’.
    6 The word “plaumorati” also appears in a text by Pliny the elder from the 1st century. White (1962) says that this word is unintelligible, but if it is replaced by ‘ploum rati’, we have the first appearance of the non-classical word ‘plough’, but he later refers to this as “the questionable emendation of the Pliny text’s plaumorati.” Further, the exact nature of Pliny’s plough has been questioned. Wailes (1972) says that it did not necessarily have a mouldboard as contented by other authors. Rapsaet (1997) notes that Pliny’s plough is often believed to be a wheel ard.
    "The Heavy Plough and the Agricultural Revolution in Medieval Europe, Thomas Barnebeck Andersen, Peter Sandholt Jensen, Christian Volmar Skovsgaard

    Quote Originally Posted by WIKIPEDIA
    The carruca or caruca was a kind of heavy plow important to medieval agriculture in Northern Europe. The carruca used a heavy iron plowshare to turn heavy soil and may have required a team of eight oxen. The carruca also bore a coulter and moldboard. It gave its name to the English carucate.
    The heavy iron moldboard plow was developed in China's Han Empire in the 1st and 2nd century. Based on linguistic evidence, the carruca may have been employed by some Slavs by ad 568.[1] It was present in Italy's Po Valley by 643 and—judging from the terminology in the Lex Alemannorum—in southwestern Germany by 720.[1]

    The carruca may have been introduced to the British Isles by the Viking invasions of England in the late 9th century.
    When and Why Was the Heavy Plough Invented?

    The development of the heavy plough by the Medieval Europeans began around the sixth century A.D. There are no recordings of a specific person inventing the heavy plough, but there are theories regarding its true origins. One theory is that it first appeared in lower Slavic lands—Bulgaria, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Macedonia, Montenegro, Serbia, and Slovenia—in 500 A.D. because the prior plough had not been efficiently tilling the land. The southern Slavs, despite bordering the Adriatic and Aegean Seas, had the same clay-like soil, just like most of northern Europe. Being in such close contact with the Mediterranean civilizations, the Slavs were in constant competition with trade. This posed as a problem for the Slavs as they were unable to keep up with Mediterranean competition and their economy and population decreased as a result.
    "Heavy Plough", Kaylee E.

    The linguistic root of the term "plow" in Germanic and Slavic is of unknown origin, but the development of indigenous terms for its parts and its use in both language groups argues that these peoples were familiar with the tool by about the fifth or sixth century. Thus it seems certain that the plow had non-Roman origins, whether in the damp coastal grasslands of the North Sea coast, as some would have it, or along the northern slopes of the eastern Alps or Carpathians, as others believe.
    "Tools, Agricultural: European"

    The new heavy, wheeled plow, with an iron plowshare, fits into this picture as well. This type of plow appears to be an invention of the Slavic world and appears to have come into Western Europe in the Carolingian period. It was used on large estates: on the estates of the Carolingian family, on the estates of the greatest churches and monasteries. But it wasn’t widely used, perhaps, until the 11th century or so when it finally began to proliferate throughout Europe.
    "The Rise of Europe in the Middle Ages"
    Last edited by Wojewoda; 2017-11-04 at 12:57.

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  14. #108
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    Here is a new article with some more developed hypotheses on the battle:

    Archäologie: Fernhandel provozierte größte Schlacht der Bronzezeit ...

    https://www.welt.de/geschichte/artic...ronzezeit.html

    DeepL translated:
    Archaeology: distant trade provoked biggest battle of the Bronze Age...

    Considering that only 460 square metres were uncovered, but the entire battlefield was at least ten times as large, we can assume that more than 1000 dead people had fallen,"says Jantzen, whose authority is carrying out the excavations together with the State Office for Monument Conservation of Lower Saxony and the University of Greifswald. This figure is based on the experience of modern battles, for which a loss rate of around 25 percent is assumed. Accordingly, four to five thousand warriors were facing each other at the Tollense around 1250 BC.

    The number forces us to correct the previous knowledge. Because 5,000 people must have been notified, brought together, organised, fed and managed. In a region for which an average population of five people per square kilometre is assumed at that time due to the available resources, this is an amazing achievement. It can only be explained by the existence of a central rule, which seemed to be unimaginable at that time. The social differentiation in northern Central Europe must therefore have been considerably more advanced than previously thought.
    -----
    In addition, the swords in particular attracted the interest of the scientists. For a long time it was believed that the rare, high-quality and correspondingly valuable weapons made of bronze would have served above all to demonstrate the prestige of their wearers. Now, however, both injuries and the signs of wear and tear on a number of found swords showed that they had indeed been used in combat.

    .............

    After all, the findings make it increasingly plausible why it was at this very point that the battle took place. In the waters of the Tollense, the excavators encountered a wooden structure that was probably part of a bridge over the much wider river. Towards them led a dam of planks. The radiocarbon dating of the bar remains showed an age of 3900 years, but the plant was still in operation at the time of the battle.

    --------------------------------

    Probably two ancient long-distance trade routes met here. They were used to transport luxury goods and strategic goods such as tin, which was needed for the production of bronze, over long distances.

    The dimensions of this long-distance trade become tangible at the Tollense. Here, the waterway reached the route from the east to Jutland and Lower Saxony via Peene and Tollense as far as the Havel to the south. At the same time, different cultures clashed here: the Nordic Bronze Age, in the west the Lüneburg culture, in the east the foothills of the Lausitz culture. It is quite possible that a regional centre still awaiting excavation existed in the settlement chamber east of the Tollense. There were archers there, many bronze arrowheads refer to connections to the east. Further west, such projectiles were rarely used at that time.

    ------------------------

    The battle did not happen by chance about 3250 years ago. At that time metal became noticeably scarce north of the Alps. Used bronze tools were recycled, new pieces were made much lighter. In addition, changes in the form of burials - burials instead of burials on earth - point to far-reaching shifts in the population. The collapse of long-distance trade anticipated a scenario that 50 years later would overwhelm the advanced civilizations of the Middle East: invasions, insurgencies, famine catastrophes and a lack of resources put an end to the highly developed Bronze Age system of states.
    Last edited by Skomand; 2017-12-04 at 01:24.

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