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Thread: Who civilized Europeans and white people?10 days old

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skomand View Post
    Nah, look what happened in Europe while Africans were still in the trees.
    Civilization, definition: "an advanced state of human society, in which a high level of culture, science, industry, and government has been reached."
    I thought I'd provide that since it seems the concept escapes you but I don't blame you since your people lacked it until it was topped with a bow and hand delivered to them. The reality of that must burn your soul which is why you're so desperate to appeal to your much more attractive Eurocentric delusions. If nothing else, that desperation is evident in the fact that you're trying to take claim to artifacts that were created by a completely different species.

    While societies in Europe looked like this:




    Other societies in Africa, Asia and the Americas looked like this:








    By their own standards of civilization, Europeans were not civilized for the majority of their history which is in large part due to the fact that "European civilization" originates OUTSIDE of Europe. That's the bitter truth you're trying to run away from.
    Last edited by Itoli; Yesterday at 15:30.

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  3. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by NonFingo View Post
    Y DNA R is nested in too many Asian macrohaplogroups to represent European ancestry. When I look at Y-DNA K-M526’s phylogeny, I see Europeans on minor Asian branches.

    I take it you see the opposite when you look at K-M526? That is, do you see Amerindians, Siberians, Oceanians, Chinese, etc. as minor casting roles and props in a European K-M526 movie?
    Europe and Caucasus are showing some interesting ancient samples

    Lucy timeline

    Sometimes history changes with new discoveries. If German town of Eppelsheim near Mainz samples are legit that would make them older than Lucy.
    http://www.ancient-origins.net/news-...671?nopaging=1
    Last edited by Silesian; Yesterday at 15:21.

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    Out of Swabia - not Africa

    http://www.faz.net/aktuell/wissen/ar...-15090833.html
    Has Homo sapiens discovered his aesthetic tendencies only here in Aurignacia? Or already where it began to spread over the world 60,000 years ago, namely in Africa? There are indeed older ornaments, such as the pattern on a red chunk of rubella from the Blombos cave or the decorated ostrich eggshells from the Diepkloof Rock Shelter, both in South Africa. All these early scratches are always abstract,"says Conard. "It's not clear what they represent. Almost twenty years ago, Conard therefore proposed the so-called "culture pump" model. It explains the relatively sudden artistic activity in Aurignacia as a result of several factors that changed the Homo sapiens groups in their immigration to Central Europe during the Ice Age: fluctuating climate, competition with other hunters and gatherers and independent innovations. It is very peculiar that this model has not been disproved to this day,"says Conard. "It would only take a credible example of older figurative representations or musical instruments in Africa or elsewhere."
    After all, the whole thing is a hypothesis, not an interpretation,"emphasizes Conard to the address of all those who occasionally suspected him of Eurocentric activities. Of course, many people would be very happy if the oldest known figurative art came from Africa. It also sounds harmonious:"The earliest modern people come from Africa, so everything else should come from there". In science, however, it does not matter what one believes or hopes for, but only what fits the data situation. But this can change, and nobody would be happier than Nicholas Conard himself, who is digging not only in Swabian, but also in Africa and Iran.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itoli View Post
    Civilization, definition: "an advanced state of human society, in which a high level of culture, science, industry, and government has been reached."
    I thought I'd provide that since it seems the concept escapes you but I don't blame you since your people lacked it until it was topped with a bow and hand delivered to them. The reality of that must burn your soul which is why you're so desperate to appeal to your much more attractive Eurocentric delusions. If nothing else, that desperation is evident in the fact that you're trying to take claim to artifacts that were created by a completely different species.

    While societies in Europe looked like this:




    Other societies in Africa, Asia and the Americas looked like this:








    By their own standards of civilization, Europeans were not civilized for the majority of their history which is in large part due to the fact that "European civilization" originates OUTSIDE of Europe. That's the bitter truth you're trying to run away from.
    You do realize that no one is responding to this because of how retarded your argument is, not because they have nothing to respond with, right? Artists's renditions of whatever the hell it is - Atlantis? A photo of something that looks like an ant hill and some Mayan pyramids (civilizations thousands of years younger than PIE). Should I start posting pictures from Star Trek and claiming it as European civilization? The level of discussion you are setting is abysmal and the problem is that you are dragging everyone to your level. I think you guys need a different forum for this, something along Ancient Aliens theme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CWF View Post
    The trade routes I'm referring to in North Africa and the Near East stretch back to the Neolithic. The timeframe of high interest here would have been 3,000-2,000 BC. I don't believe chariots predated these trade routes.

    Who in the hell told you the intent was to get to Pontic-Steppe? What is it with you Euros always thinking you live in paradise? No one gave a crap about the Pontic-Steppe. You people were in netherlands to the north of civilization. It wasn't about you.

    And yes, the North Africans had the ability to travel over seas. You didn't.


    http://theancientneareast.com/the-br...-world-system/
    https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...1203082704.htm
    Well your own pictures shows the routes ending in Caucasus mountains.
    You are the one who claimed that Pontic Steppe was on route from Africa to E.Asia, not me. And I sure as hell didn't say that someone needed to get there. I said that for one to go there, one would need to cross either sea or mountains. IF that was their goal. Learn to read contextually.
    Whatever point you were trying to make with those articles is lost on me. Have a nice day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by voron View Post
    Well your own pictures shows the routes ending in Caucasus mountains.
    You are the one who claimed that Pontic Steppe was on route from Africa to E.Asia, not me. And I sure as hell didn't say that someone needed to get there. I said that for one to go there, one would need to cross either sea or mountains. IF that was their goal. Learn to read contextually.
    Whatever point you were trying to make with those articles is lost on me. Have a nice day.
    Ha! I answered your skepticism of the time period, the geography and the connection to North Africa and the Near East. I have also now demonstrated my original point of the problem with the Eurocentric approach twice. I'll note your petty criticism for what it is and wish you a good day as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by voron View Post
    You do realize that no one is responding to this because of how retarded your argument is, not because they have nothing to respond with, right? Artists's renditions of whatever the hell it is - Atlantis? A photo of something that looks like an ant hill and some Mayan pyramids (civilizations thousands of years younger than PIE). Should I start posting pictures from Star Trek and claiming it as European civilization? The level of discussion you are setting is abysmal and the problem is that you are dragging everyone to your level. I think you guys need a different forum for this, something along Ancient Aliens theme.
    Those are artistic renditions of Mayan, Egyptian, and Sumerian ruins (i.e. still there today) in comparison to a Celtic village of the same time period. You have no response because you have no argument. Any argument going forward trying to claim the Celts were more advanced than the Sumerians is a "retarded" joke. THAT is the reason you **can't** respond but the posturing is expected.

    Here are the ruins, though, since your dumb uncultured ass thought it was Atlantis





    Last edited by Itoli; Yesterday at 22:35.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itoli View Post
    Eastern Asia? Yes. Middle East? Yes. North Africa? Yes. Europe? LOL. Most of Europe was not a thought for most of recorded History. Europe does not have a single independent center of "civilization". The earliest "civilizations" in Europe, Greece and Rome, were late to the game, situated in a WARM climate and were a result of Middle Eastern and North African developments. Northern Europe didn't even develop "civilization" until after the Roman conquest due the direct adoption of their political and cultural practices. So, please explain how the cold "civilized" you when most of you were living the very tribal lifestyles you today degrade as primitive, for the great majority of your history?
    The Greeks and Romans were cold climate selected white people, and it is logical that these would then spread and prosper to hospitable climates where it was much easier to build prosperous civilizations. While you say they were late to the game, in fact they and their predecessor civilisations surpassed not only Sub-Saharan Africa for all of recorded history - which is barely relevant in this discussion - but also the Far East, in terms of cultural, scientific and economic achievements, for most of recorded history. However we don't even need to go to such and abstract level, just look at the differences in genetics and outcome between cold climate selected peoples and war climate selected peoples, and the argument is done.
    Last edited by Weizen Bündel; Today at 01:23.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itoli View Post
    Those are artistic renditions of Mayan, Egyptian, and Sumerian ruins (i.e. still there today) in comparison to a Celtic village of the same time period. You have no response because you have no argument. Any argument going forward trying to claim the Celts were more advanced than the Sumerians is a "retarded" joke. THAT is the reason you **can't** respond but the posturing is expected.

    Here are the ruins, though, since your dumb uncultured ass thought it was Atlantis





    Appearances are deceiving:

    The burial chamber of a Mayan prince 1300 years old:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...ish-gifts.html

    The burial chamber of a Celtic prince 2500 years old.

    https://www.google.de/search?q=kelti...EIKDAA#imgrc=_

    https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keltenmuseum_Hochdorf

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    Quote Originally Posted by Skomand View Post
    Appearances are deceiving:

    The burial chamber of a Mayan prince 1300 years old:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...ish-gifts.html

    The burial chamber of a Celtic prince 2500 years old.

    https://www.google.de/search?q=kelti...EIKDAA#imgrc=_

    https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keltenmuseum_Hochdorf
    Thing is, these finds will most probably multiply soon in Europe. Due to heavy forrestation, raise and fall of communities (forgotten, abandoned towns and villages are aplenty in Europe) and intensive farming for thousands of years it is extremely easy to miss structures that are thousands of years old. Georadars, lasers and drones start to bring their fruit however.

    It is not barren wasteland like Egypt of Sumer - it is heavily populated continent were people used to dismantle ancient ruins to build new structures and were many civilisations clashed and collapsed (the biggest port at the Baltic - Winieta*, has not been found yet, and there are historical records for it - just one example of a Citi that vanished no more than a thousand years ago).

    * Winieta close to Świnoujście, might be in fact the really ancient port were Amber Route begun/crossed. Another would be Truso in Old Prussian lands - close to Elbląg and not found yet either.
    Both existed still in Viking age and Winieta, in its last centuries, for sure was Slavic dominated, yet multi ethnic port were Vikings, Scandinavian tradesmen, Greeks and whoever else coexisted peacefully within Pomeranian Slavic context.
    Last edited by Pioterus; Today at 05:16.
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