User Tag List

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3
Results 21 to 27 of 27

Thread: What makes her look Jewish?15 days old

  1. #21
    Regular Member
    Junior Member
    Last Online
    Today @ 08:33
    Join Date
    2018-03-12
    Posts
    62
    Gender
    Israel Star of David India United States France

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by voyager View Post
    I thought there was a lack of IBD sharing between Italian and Jews.
    There is no consensus on whether Southern Euro admixture of Jews is more Italian or more Greek.

    This article indicates it might be mostly Greek: https://www.theopavlidis.com/MidEast/part10.htm

    And Sephardic Jews have some extra Iberian, as they also mixed with the locals after moving there.

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to Yuval Levental For This Useful Post:

    voyager (2018-05-12)

  3. # ADS
    Advertisement bot
    Join Date
    2013-03-24
    Posts
    All threads
       
     

  4. #22
    Established Member
    Slayer of Bullshit
    Last Online
    @
    Join Date
    2009-10-23
    Posts
    2,851
    Gender
    Phenotype
    Mediterranid
    Metaethnos
    European
    Phenotype
    UP/Atlanto-Med
    Religion
    All's fair in love&war

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Yuval Levental View Post
    There is no consensus on whether Southern Euro admixture of Jews is more Italian or more Greek.

    This article indicates it might be mostly Greek: https://www.theopavlidis.com/MidEast/part10.htm

    And Sephardic Jews have some extra Iberian, as they also mixed with the locals after moving there.
    It must be significant that inscriptions in Jewish catacombs in ancient Rome were nearly all in GREEK with only a very few in Latin or Hebrew/Aramaic.
    YOU ARE ENTITLED TO YOUR OWN OPINIONS... BUT NOT YOUR OWN FACTS.

  5. #23
    Regular Member
    Junior Member
    Last Online
    Today @ 08:33
    Join Date
    2018-03-12
    Posts
    62
    Gender
    Israel Star of David India United States France

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by CrazyDaisy View Post
    she just doesn’t have stereotypical Jewish features like a long face or hook nose
    Less than half of Jews have stereotypical Jewish features. IIRC, according to Carleton Coon only around 40% of Jews have hook noses. And according to Maurice Fischberg, most Jews are brachycephalic (I think it means round-headed?):

    https://archive.org/details/jstor-659377

  6. #24
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist tauromenion's Avatar
    Last Online
    Today @ 02:45
    Join Date
    2012-08-09
    Posts
    7,335
    Gender
    Y-DNA
    R1a1a
    mtDNA
    H
    Race
    Caucasoid
    Phenotype
    Mediterranid
    Politics
    Moderate.
    Italy Sicily-II Greece Portugal Israel Star of David Poland Cape Verde

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by voyager View Post
    I thought there was a lack of IBD sharing between Italian and Jews.
    That could be because the connection is so old (2000 years). IBD sharing shows how recent a match is. So if you are seeing IBD sharing between Greece and Ashkenazim, it is likely recent and NOT due to the formative wave of European ancestry in Ashkenazim. There is also high IBD sharing between Ashkenazim and Poles, and clearly this is the same situation.. a matter of recent, not amount.

    Ashkenazim are best modeled as north Italian and Levantine from an autosomal point of view. But the Italian and Levantine DNA have been merged for so long and the population became inbred that the population could have experienced drift. On the other hand, Greek or Slavic input into Ashkenazim would have been a recent admixture.

    Inscriptions on their graves in Greek and not in Latin could have been that the Jewish population in Italy was first present in the south, where Greek was still spoken.

    There is also a near complete lack of IBD sharing between mainland Greeks and Sicilians/Calabrese despite that there was settlement from the former to the latter in ancient times. Like with Italic ancestry in Jews, it is too far back to pick up on it. Though I fall into the camp that believes that Greek ancestry in southern Italy has been heavily admixed with Italic and Levantine/Mesopotamian elements that were already in the area that it is likely difficult today to separate it into distinct chunks of DNA to assess with IBD.

    IBD sharing with Ashkenazim coming through as Greek, Polish, etc. is likely recent admixture from the last 500 years.
    Last edited by tauromenion; 2018-05-16 at 14:37.

  7. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to tauromenion For This Useful Post:

    Targum (2018-05-16), voyager (2018-05-16)

  8. #25
    Regular Member
    Junior Member
    Last Online
    Today @ 08:33
    Join Date
    2018-03-12
    Posts
    62
    Gender
    Israel Star of David India United States France

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tauromenion View Post
    Ashkenazim are best modeled as north Italian and Levantine from an autosomal point of view.
    What if they are Levantine + South Italian or Central Italian + North/Eastern European?

    A mix of Greek or South/Central Italian + North/East European might look like just North Italian.

    Because North Italian can be modeled as Central Italian + some extra northern admix.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Aren't Ashkenazi Jews also partially French and/or German?

    They lived in the Rhineland for some time before moving to Poland.
    Last edited by Yuval Levental; 2018-05-16 at 18:31.

  9. #26
    Regular Member
    Junior Member
    Last Online
    Today @ 08:33
    Join Date
    2018-03-12
    Posts
    62
    Gender
    Israel Star of David India United States France

    Default

    Many Ashkenazim are depigmented despite their southern genetics.

  10. #27
    Established Member
    Molecular Biologist tauromenion's Avatar
    Last Online
    Today @ 02:45
    Join Date
    2012-08-09
    Posts
    7,335
    Gender
    Y-DNA
    R1a1a
    mtDNA
    H
    Race
    Caucasoid
    Phenotype
    Mediterranid
    Politics
    Moderate.
    Italy Sicily-II Greece Portugal Israel Star of David Poland Cape Verde

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Yuval Levental View Post
    What if they are Levantine + South Italian or Central Italian + North/Eastern European?

    A mix of Greek or South/Central Italian + North/East European might look like just North Italian.

    Because North Italian can be modeled as Central Italian + some extra northern admix.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Aren't Ashkenazi Jews also partially French and/or German?

    They lived in the Rhineland for some time before moving to Poland.
    Greek is similar to someone who is 3/4 south Italian and 1/4 Polish/Hungarian/etc. So a mixture of Greek and Northeast European would likely be too much shifted toward NE Europe for Ashkenazim, even if half Levantine.

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3

Similar Threads

  1. Arab/Jewish; Muslim/Jewish; Muslim/Christian... ect. marriages
    By Una in forum Race & Ethnicity in Society
    Replies: 47
    Last Post: 2015-03-07, 06:41
  2. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 2014-11-12, 11:47
  3. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 2014-02-10, 09:26
  4. What makes SSA so different?
    By Esther in forum Race & Ethnicity in Society
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 2011-03-19, 20:32

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
<