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Thread: The Garamantes, a Saharan Berber civilization82 days old

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    And that is the problem with trying to use ancient terminology to to infer modern concepts of race. The Garamantes are described as dark akin to aethiopians, but Heredotus referred to them as Libyans and in that sense he could be referring to language, culture, way of dress, etc. It's more accurate to go by descriptions if we're going to apply our concept of race to people who predated it.
    Last edited by Itoli; 2018-07-06 at 20:42.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Itoli View Post
    And that is the problem with trying to use ancient terminology to infer modern concepts of race. The Garamantes are described as dark akin to aethiopians, but Heredotus referred to them as Libyans and in that sense he could be referring to language, culture, way of dress, etc. It's more accurate to go by descriptions if we're going to apply our concept of race to people who predated it.
    I personally imagine aethiopes as referring to the very darkest Africans, most particularly the people of Kush (or "Nubia"). That would account for the Greeks and Romans calling some African nationalities, like the Egyptians, melanchroes ("black or dark-colored") but not aethiopes like they would Kushites and other Sudanese. It would be like our distinction between "black" as an ethnic or sociocultural construct and a descriptor like "ebony" for the very darkest skin. Not saying this is an authoritative interpretation by any means, but that is what makes the most sense to me.
    Knowledge is consciousness of reality. Reality is the sum of the laws that govern nature and of the causes from which they flow.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truthcentric View Post
    I personally imagine aethiopes as referring to the very darkest Africans, most particularly the people of Kush (or "Nubia"). That would account for the Greeks and Romans calling some African nationalities, like the Egyptians, melanchroes ("black or dark-colored") but not aethiopes like they would Kushites and other Sudanese. It would be like our distinction between "black" as an ethnic or sociocultural construct and a descriptor like "ebony" for the very darkest skin. Not saying this is an authoritative interpretation by any means, but that is what makes the most sense to me.
    Melanchroes can just mean tanned or relatively darker than europeans. In that description Herodotus was saying that the Colchians, i.e. people from the area of Georgia in the Caucasus, resembled Egyptians. And Georgians aren't/weren't black or negroid. Hippocrates, writing around the same time, described the Colchians as 'sallow', which means yellowish or pale brown. Some Georgians still seem to have a yellowish/pale brownish complexion today. For example this Georgian lady, who looks similar to an Egyptian Copt:

    https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qim...9494be3b97bf-c

    https://www.schmopera.com/scene/peop...achvelishvili/

    So Herodotus was basically just describing people who looked like Copts today. This makes sense as not much later the Fayum portraits started to be produced and they depict people who look like Copts. Furthermore Copts are the only people anywhere who still speak a form of the ancient Egyptian language.

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    "Ptolemy II had early on referred to the Garamantes as "somewhat black" and "more likely Ethiopians" rather than Libyans."

    That sounds like they were mixed.

    Do you have the original quotes rather than things written by modern authors?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reason1234 View Post
    "Ptolemy II had early on referred to the Garamantes as "somewhat black" and "more likely Ethiopians" rather than Libyans."

    That sounds like they were mixed.

    Do you have the original quotes rather than things written by modern authors?
    A combination of Nilote Berber and Horner IS “mixed”
    Have you ever read ANY publications regarding Garamante? Their food producing technology, material culture, pottery traditions, linguistic affinity or physical remains? Have you ever read any publication on the material culture and archeology of southern Libya?

    If so, how would you sum up its 10ky history?
    If not, what then is your opinion based off of?

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