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Thread: Are nationalists generally nuts?364 days old

  1. #1
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    Default Are nationalists generally nuts?

    I've noticed that a common thread running through nationalist movements is that they tend to be populated predominantly by some of the most unhinged people in the world. It doesn't matter whether they define their "nation" by race, religion, nationality, ethnicity, or any other division of humankind you can imagine. They almost all seem to be toxic gas bags. Typical nationalist characteristics I've observed include...

    1) Xenophobic hostility and distrust towards outsiders.

    2) Territorial separatism that leads to intolerance of love and relationships between people of different "nations". This is truest of all if the relationships in question are between "their" women and "other" men.

    3) A paranoid victim mentality prone to conspiracy theories and a delusional belief that the world is out to get them. The Jews or "cultural Marxists" in white nationalist thought are classic examples of this.

    4) A ravenous appetite for pseudoscience and historical revisionism, especially if it celebrates their own group and depreciates their "enemies".

    5) Retrograde attitudes towards women's rights and LGBT+ people. This may be a less universal feature among nationalists since one could theoretically be a nationalist and a feminist or pro-LGBT+ as long as women and LGBT+ were considered part of the "nation". Nonetheless, there seems to be a significant overlap in the ranks of nationalists and anti-feminist types, and of course there's the possessive attitude nationalist men often have towards "their" women as said in point 1.

    6) Many of them just seem plain vicious, immature, and insecure in my experience.

    Mind you, there should be nothing wrong with a little national pride, or at least not feeling ashamed of one's own nationality or heritage, as long as one didn't put down or marginalize people outside that grouping. My understanding is that movements like "Black Power" got started like this, since they were meant to imbue African and Afro-Diasporan people with a lack of shame over their heritage in the face of institutionalized white supremacy and imperialism. But when pride starts swelling into nationalistic xenophobia, separatism, and general toxicity, it evolves into a dangerous beast that has wrought so much destruction, death, and injustice throughout human history.

    What are your guys' thoughts on this?
    Knowledge is consciousness of reality. Reality is the sum of the laws that govern nature and of the causes from which they flow.
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    In America yes. Other paces no.
    Nationalism is good at trumping Tribalism in multi-ethnic societies. Think African nations.
    In America and western nations : No, whites don’t want to chill with American blacks nor immigrants. Racism > Nation.....even in spite of face.

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    Humans have a design. Not by God, but by Darwinian evolution. Rationality is not the design of the humans. The design of humans is the maximum propagation of their own genetic variants. Humans are in part intelligent and rational, but that is only a means to the end of the maximum propagation of the genetic variants each person carries. Also to that end is an instinct for tribalism. A tribe is a group of people who tend to share one's own genetic variants. The maximum reproduction of one's own tribe is a means toward the maximum propagation of the genetic variants each person carries. Allowing women of one's own tribe to be claimed by men of a different tribe is a failure toward that end. Winning means one's own men claim the women of other tribes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ApostateAbe View Post
    Humans have a design. Not by God, but by Darwinian evolution. Rationality is not the design of the humans. The design of humans is the maximum propagation of their own genetic variants. Humans are in part intelligent and rational, but that is only a means to the end of the maximum propagation of the genetic variants each person carries. Also to that end is an instinct for tribalism. A tribe is a group of people who tend to share one's own genetic variants. The maximum reproduction of one's own tribe is a means toward the maximum propagation of the genetic variants each person carries. Allowing women of one's own tribe to be claimed by men of a different tribe is a failure toward that end. Winning means one's own men claim the women of other tribes.
    Where is the logic?
    Absorbing women from another tribe is as much "miscegenation" as alien men mixing with your women.
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    Quote Originally Posted by voyager View Post
    Where is the logic?
    Absorbing women from another tribe is as much "miscegenation" as alien men mixing with your women.
    Miscegenation tends to provoke an angrier reaction when women of one's own race mate outside the race, as opposed to the men mating outside the race, and I think the reason is rooted in evolutionary biology. Men have a greater maximum reproductive potential than women. Men can reproduce perhaps once every day, whereas women can reproduce once every nine months. If a black man screws a white woman, then he can very easily go back to screwing black women again and fathering more children the next day. But, if a black woman screws a white man, then that slot of reproductive opportunity for black men may be lost for a full nine months. To express it in terms of the Selfish Gene: the genetic variants of the black race become less frequent as a result of a black female mating outside the race as opposed to inside.

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    Default

    It depends on the type of nationalism. Nationalism can have positive effects like mobilizing people to help people on the other side of the country effected by natural disasters. Think the wildfires here in Canada in 2016 that displaced a whole city.

    Although we are an outlier. Apparently according to surveys, among Canadians, the more nationalistic they are, the less xenophobic they are, which is the opposite of most countries. Don’t know why that is, honestly. But I guess, as being someone who is quite nationalistic myself, I like it when people from other cultures experience and learn about my own, especially when they enjoy it.
    Last edited by DragonRouge; 2018-08-22 at 13:17.

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    Quote Originally Posted by beyoku View Post
    In America yes. Other paces no.
    Nationalism is good at trumping Tribalism in multi-ethnic societies. Think African nations.
    In America and western nations : No, whites don’t want to chill with American blacks nor immigrants. Racism > Nation.....even in spite of face.
    Just as our planet is a sphere, so is every opinion a fluid one. Yours isnt fluid. What you've written is drivel. "Oh Im a poor negro and some folks ruin it. But in other places nationalism is good".

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    Quote Originally Posted by beyoku View Post
    In America yes. Other paces no.
    Nationalism is good at trumping Tribalism in multi-ethnic societies. Think African nations.
    In America and western nations : No, whites don’t want to chill with American blacks nor immigrants. Racism > Nation.....even in spite of face.
    In America and western nations you're a White Nationalist/KKK/Nazi if your a nationalist then. But of course, but of course.
    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Essien View Post
    • The Grimaldi African occupied Europe in ancient times.
    • The original Celtic priesthood were Blacks.
    • Black people constructed Stonehenge.
    • The Scots are themselves of Black origin.
    • The Irish are of black origin.
    • The Knights of King Arthur's round table were Blacks.
    • There was an African, Gormund who ruled Ireland at the time of the Anglo-Saxons.
    • The first King to unite Norway was Black. He was known as Halfdan the Black.
    http://i.imgur.com/uSkUyji.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by MnM View Post
    In America and western nations you're a White Nationalist/KKK/Nazi if your a nationalist then. But of course, but of course.
    No dummy. When Nigerians or Ethiopians be like: "fuck tribalism, lets get this money for the good of the Nation because we are all "Nigerian" and "Ethiopian" - that shit works. Its the opposite of divide and conquer. It really works when you are up against a foreign adversary like Britain or Italy.

    OTOH....in America. "Make America great again" is not talking about including African Americans. The alt Right doesn't include room for African Americans. In a world where rising tides "lift all boats" white America is still like "fuck black boats". What better example than Negroes going off to fight Nazis and Japanese when they were trying to take over the damn planet and came home to Jim crow racism.....and were basically excluded from the G.I Bill.

    So listen dummy, Nationalism can trump Tribalism so long as we are all the same race. Nationalism on the other hand don't trump Racism because racism has the unique tenancy of excluding a portion of its own"Nationals" from the "Nation". The explanation i just gave you is the main reason "White people" were invented in the first place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Truthcentric View Post
    3) A paranoid victim mentality prone to conspiracy theories and a delusional belief that the world is out to get them. The Jews or "cultural Marxists" in white nationalist thought are classic examples of this.
    Nationalists are marginalizied in most (if not all?) western countries, so the world is out to get them.

    5) Retrograde attitudes towards women's rights and LGBT+ people. This may be a less universal feature among nationalists since one could theoretically be a nationalist and a feminist or pro-LGBT+ as long as women and LGBT+ were considered part of the "nation". Nonetheless, there seems to be a significant overlap in the ranks of nationalists and anti-feminist types, and of course there's the possessive attitude nationalist men often have towards "their" women as said in point 1.
    Women's rights and modern feminism is not the same thing. Compare women's rights in India or many African countries to modern feminism in the west. While it is true that many nationalists see the ideal relationship with women as caretakers of home and children full time; I've never heard on nationalists who say women shouldn't be allowed to work, vote or participate in society. Infact many nationalists think men have the responsibility to make sure rape and abuse of women doesn't occur, something they actually have in common with feminists.

    My understanding is that movements like "Black Power" got started like this, since they were meant to imbue African and Afro-Diasporan people with a lack of shame over their heritage in the face of institutionalized white supremacy and imperialism. But when pride starts swelling into nationalistic xenophobia, separatism, and general toxicity, it evolves into a dangerous beast that has wrought so much destruction, death, and injustice throughout human history.
    Considering how blacks have been treated in the US by whites, they have the right to talk down on whites. They were taken to US without consent and have been part of making the US great. They can talk down on whites how much they want imo.

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